Help Save Somesongs!

fluffy · Post by **fluffy** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:45 pm

jute gyte wrote:Has anyone else had a problem with their songs becoming "hidden" for no reason? I just checked and all but my most recently posted song was hidden. (The files on the webspace haven't moved in years, so that's not it.)

If people click 'report dead link' enough times then it's hidden. As far as I can tell there's no bot which actually checks the files... it's just based on user clicks. So if you really want to annoy someone you don't like, well, you know what to do.

(The first comedy genius to do this to my songs gets everyone's admiration and respect.)

frankie big face · Post by **frankie big face** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:53 pm

My understanding is that new users can now register glitch-free.

Go new users! Rate some songs! GO GO GO!!

tuuur · Post by **tuuur** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:17 am

fluffy wrote:
jute gyte wrote:Has anyone else had a problem with their songs becoming "hidden" for no reason? I just checked and all but my most recently posted song was hidden. (The files on the webspace haven't moved in years, so that's not it.)
If people click 'report dead link' enough times then it's hidden. As far as I can tell there's no bot which actually checks the files... it's just based on user clicks. So if you really want to annoy someone you don't like, well, you know what to do.

(The first comedy genius to do this to my songs gets everyone's admiration and respect.)

I sometimes pushed it accidentally when I intented to push the Mark Rated Without Rating button, and the message I got was:

This link seems to check out, but a message will be sent to the administrator just in case.

Seems to me that you can't get a song hidden that way...

fluffy · Post by **fluffy** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:45 pm

Oh, that's good. I'd hate to think you got my songs hidden because "there's no song here" or " forgot to sing."

tuuur · Post by **tuuur** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:17 pm

fluffy wrote:Oh, that's good. I'd hate to think you got my songs hidden because "there's no song here" or " forgot to sing."

I'd hate that too, because I wouldn't want that to happen.
Honestly, just because I don't like a song of you, or don't rate tunes without vocals, doesn't mean I don't respect that you (or others) do.

madtho · Post by **madtho** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 12:51 pm

Funny.
I had just tried registering again today (after quite a time of no success) and succeeded! Then discovered this thread.

So for your consideration is a remix of last week's They Control the Weather.

I've been looking for a songfight/somesongs resource for quite some time, but i think the bugbear(s) of somesongs are the interface and the 1 post a day limit. Maybe 1 song a day after the first day so I could throw a few things up there?

anyway it's good.

-mad

Kill Me Sarah · Post by **Kill Me Sarah** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:59 am

I just went back to look and sure enough, Mr. Tuuur had rated all of my songs. It made me remember why I stopped posting to SomeSongs - no one every liked anything I did. I think the same holds true here, which is probably why FAWM is such a breath of fresh air.

roymond · Post by **roymond** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:09 pm

madtho wrote:i think the bugbear(s) of somesongs are the interface and the 1 post a day limit.

For many people the interface is its beauty. I so wish more sites were that simple, straight forward and in line with their mission. The one post a day limit keeps the line up mixed and ensures there aren't floods of crap or artists. I think it serves the listeners/reviewers by making artists think more about what they post there.

Project-D · Post by **Project-D** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:58 am

Kill Me Sarah wrote:I just went back to look and sure enough, Mr. Tuuur had rated all of my songs. It made me remember why I stopped posting to SomeSongs - no one every liked anything I did. I think the same holds true here, which is probably why FAWM is such a breath of fresh air.

I know what you're saying although I didn't want to be accused of sour grapes just for pointing that out so I'm glad you beat me to it. I stopped posting because I was tired of waiting two weeks to get enough reviews for a score while the little mutual admiration society would get enough reviews to be scored in a couple of hours.

Märk · Post by **Märk** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 8:57 am

Project-D wrote:little mutual admiration society

Man, ain't that the truth.

jack · Post by **jack** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 11:44 am

Project-D wrote:
Kill Me Sarah wrote:I just went back to look and sure enough, Mr. Tuuur had rated all of my songs. It made me remember why I stopped posting to SomeSongs - no one every liked anything I did. I think the same holds true here, which is probably why FAWM is such a breath of fresh air.
I know what you're saying although I didn't want to be accused of sour grapes just for pointing that out so I'm glad you beat me to it. I stopped posting because I was tired of waiting two weeks to get enough reviews for a score while the little mutual admiration society would get enough reviews to be scored in a couple of hours.

nothing personal, and i don't entirely disagree with you, but i looked on somesongs and unless i'm mistaken, the last time you commented on a song over there was june of last year. i also noticed you've got a number of songs there with enough comments and votes to have a rating. you even have something listed on the main page with a rating and yet you still complain about apathy for your songs, yet show little to no consideration for commenting on others.

so walk the walk instead of just talking the talk.

frankie big face · Post by **frankie big face** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:09 pm

jack wrote: so walk the walk instead of just talking the talk.

Spoken just like a member of Mutual Admiration Society.

Fascist.

Märk · Post by **Märk** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:19 pm

frankie big face wrote:
jack wrote: so walk the walk instead of just talking the talk.
Spoken just like a member of Mutual Admiration Society.

Fascist.

This coming from the guy who has an official member card and knows the secret handshake. You're fooling no one, comrade bigface.

Project-D · Post by **Project-D** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:23 pm

Fair enough Jack, that's my fault, and it's something I should fix. I should have said votes instead of reviews. I haven't done any reviews lately but I can (and do) at least click the damn [good][ok][bad] button. That's all I ask in return.

You have to admit it's a little discouraging to go vote on a song with a [2] after being put up the day before, when yours is sitting there with a [3] by it after almost a week. That's why I haven't posted songs or reviews in over 6 months. I just kind of forgot about it. You put a song up, check it every couple days, see a vote, check it every three, the three turns to five which turns to a week, then to two weeks which is about how long it took me to get 5 button clicks.

That's the whole crux of this thread - why don't people use Somesongs more. That's why I don't. I just kind of forgot it was there.

Now that you've said that though, it made me realize something, can you see your comments before you have 5 ratings? 'Cause that might give me an attitude adjustment. Still for all my whining, I'm not totally full of crap am I?

jack · Post by **jack** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 4:29 pm

Project-D wrote:
Now that you've said that though, it made me realize something, can you see your comments before you have 5 ratings? 'Cause that might give me an attitude adjustment. Still for all my whining, I'm not totally full of crap am I?

yes. you can see your comments, not that you're full of crap.

frankie big face · Post by **frankie big face** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 4:45 pm

Project-D wrote: Now that you've said that though, it made me realize something, can you see your comments before you have 5 ratings? 'Cause that might give me an attitude adjustment. Still for all my whining, I'm not totally full of crap am I?

Yes, you can see comments before you get five votes. By the way, the whole reason the 5-vote "waiting period" was put in place was to discourage people from either a) being influenced by a low score to think less of the songs or worse b) to discourage people from passing over a song that has only a few votes and a very low rating. (For example, if you only have two votes and your song has a 2.5, someone may skip it without seeing tha it only has two votes.) This "waiting period" was put in place at a time when there was MUCH higher somesongs traffic and it didn't take very long to get five votes. These days, it takes a lot longer, hence this thread to encourage more people to go there.

Look, if you are familiar with and like someone's music and you see they have a new song posted, you're going to click the play button. You're not going to say "oh hey, maybe I should listen to this other guy's song because he has fewer votes." That's just not the way people think. I don't know anything about Dynamic Rhythm Device, so I'm not surprised they only have 4 votes and the song above them (by well-know, and relatively tried and true Merisan) has 8. Does that mean there's a mutual admiration society? Maybe. But are the people who make that claim pissed because it exists or because they're not members?

When I started this thread, I suggested people post a link to a song of theirs they would like others to listen to and rate, but I didn't see anything from you. In the meantime, you're wanting more attention, but you never post any comments. I find that people reciprocate on somesongs if you give them a chance or a reason. (Sometimes they reciprocate by just downvoting all your songs. That's what being in the MAS gets you.)

I might be a little extra sore on the latter point with you because I made you a Gift of Music and you didn't even acknowledge it! Even if you hated it, a "gee, that was an unusual direction you took with that song" would have been nice.

Märk · Post by **Märk** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:18 pm

I recently (well, several months ago) turned a musician friend of mine onto somesongs. He told me a few weeks later, after submitting a couple songs, checking out a bunch of music, voting, etc., that he suspects there is a clique there that always votes each others' songs up. I asked him why he thought this, and he replied "That Frankie Bigface guy... man, his music is *terrible*, but he always gets really high marks. He must be getting his friends to vote him up or something".

I'm not trying to start something here, just enlightening you to the fact that it's not just people here who perceive some sort of 'mutual admiration society' there.

[edit] Also, your explanation about seeing something unfamiliar and skipping over it for something 'tried tested and true' does not help your cause at all. Why the hell would anyone new want to post songs there after reading that?

jack · Post by **jack** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:39 pm

first, let me say that that while everyone is certainly entitled to an opinion about frankie's music, as a musician sven (can i still call you that?) you have to respect the fact that frank takes pride in the quality of the product he puts out there, and i think that aspect of his songs is for the most part pretty unquestionable from a sheer production perspective. you might not like his style, but as a practicing songwriter yourself, you should respect his craft. it sounds more like sour grapes to me.

if frank seems to get alot of comments or good marks, what's wrong with that? he's done more than just submit songs, he has made himself part of that community, and he has a long history with the site. just like you. you have also been on the receiving end of the same thing you are criticizing him for. his point about listening to other people you are familiar with seems pretty obvious to me, nobody is under any obligation to listen to anyone else, and i myself typically will listen first to people i'm familiar with. thats just human nature, not bias or any "mutual admiration society". it's familiarity, followed by listening to something by someone i don't know but others i might know like, followed far behind by "oh what the fuck, here goes nothing...". can you honestly say you don't listen to artists you are familiar with before artists you aren't? i doubt it. frankie has fans that leave comments, good and bad, and he shows generally honest appreciation for the time and effort spent doing so.

somesongs needs more frankie big faces and fewer people whining about a lack of comments and attention. make something worthy and give back to the community and you'll get attention.

Märk · Post by **Märk** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 8:02 pm

Where did I say I don't like Frankie's music or respect him as an artist? I quoted, pretty much verbatim, what my friend and old bandmate Dayton said about him...

And once again, what motivation is there for new artists to jump into the somesongs thing when people are just going to pass them over for something more familiar anyway?

jack · Post by **jack** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 8:15 pm

Märk wrote: And once again, what motivation is there for new artists to jump into the somesongs thing when people are just going to pass them over for something more familiar anyway?

exposure. feedback, sometimes brutally honest. in the marketing world, we call it building a brand.

it's like the radio. the radio plays songs that are familiar. why? because that's what people want to hear. people work really hard to get heard on the radio so people might hear them and become familiar with them, and buy their records and go to their shows and make them rich and famous.

you don't start out being familiar. you earn it. or maybe buy it. somesongs removes the discretionary role of "music director" and lets anyone get heard, despite the obvious signal to noise issue. just because your song doesn't get rated or doesn't have comments, it doesn't mean your song isn't being heard by god knows how many strangers in faraway places. is that worth something to anyone? i would think so.

if your friend (or anyone else) can't understand or appreciate that reason to participate, i'm wasting my virtual breath here.

also, i didn't mean to make it sound like you had any issue with frank, even though it might have kind of sounded that way. it was a more a response to your friend and you were more like his receiving end proxy...you're more asset than asshole to somesongs sven

Project-D · Post by **Project-D** » Sat Feb 16, 2008 8:22 pm

frankie big face wrote:I might be a little extra sore on the latter point with you because I made you a Gift of Music and you didn't even acknowledge it! Even if you hated it, a "gee, that was an unusual direction you took with that song" would have been nice.

You're right, I've been coming off as a dick. Honestly it wasn't my favorite take on the song and I wasn't sure what to say, which is strange, because I like most everything of yours I hear. Still that was no excuse for not saying thank you because you were kind enough to do it. So sorry, sorry and thank you.

frankie big face · Post by **frankie big face** » Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:23 am

Märk wrote:I recently (well, several months ago) turned a musician friend of mine onto somesongs. He told me a few weeks later, after submitting a couple songs, checking out a bunch of music, voting, etc., that he suspects there is a clique there that always votes each others' songs up. I asked him why he thought this, and he replied "That Frankie Bigface guy... man, his music is *terrible*, but he always gets really high marks. He must be getting his friends to vote him up or something".

What's your friend's artist name on somesongs? Or his screen name? I'd like to listen to some of his music and check out his comments and read the comments you've written about his music, etc.

My most popular song is probably Locked Box. It has an 8.6 rating. (I'm not counting all the songs I have that are still under 15 votes.) It has 125 votes. Do you really think I have 125 friends? And I asked them to spread their votes out over of 5-year time period so people won't get suspicious? Believe me, there is much more downvoting of my songs than upvoting.

I don't really care if you don't like my music. I've rated your songs fairly (some good and some bad) and left comments when I felt like it. You've commented on exactly one of my songs and I thanked you for it despite the fact that it was negative. I'm not responsible for anyone's behavior but my own and I think I've been fair when it comes to you and anyone who's posted on somesongs.