What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Discuss upcoming, current, and previous song fights.
User avatar
sleepysilverdoor
Panama
Posts: 813
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2010 11:02 pm
Instruments: Basically if I don't have to blow through it it's fair game.
Recording Method: FL Studio/Tascam US600
Submitting as: Phlebia, mostly.
Pronouns: he
Location: Atlanta-ish.

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by sleepysilverdoor »

thirdcatmusic wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 3:08 pm

Phlebia - absolutely bonkers. great insane drums. I remember thinking some of your stuff sounds like atari teenage riot. this sounds like atari teenage riot if they used real instruments instead of going the techno route. VOTE.
I didn't really have a particular artist in mind for this one stylistically, basically just "hyper-aggressive" nu-metal/metalcore type stuff...hence the breakdown and vocal fry everywhere. [edit]okay, maybe Iowa-era Slipknot[/edit]

That said, one of my main drum exercises for years was popping in headphones and playing along to ATR and Alec Empire. And my first SF entry was a blatent ATR rip-off. So yes, influence is there! And very present.
Last edited by sleepysilverdoor on Wed Dec 02, 2020 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"There's a lot to be said about a full-on frontal assault on the ear drums" - Pigfarmer Jr.
User avatar
lichenthroat
Push Comes to Shove
Posts: 410
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2016 12:54 pm
Recording Method: MuseScore & Ardour or Reaper
Submitting as: Lichen Throat, Dimetrodon, Sparetooth, Escapegoat
Pronouns: he/him
Location: New Mexico

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by lichenthroat »

mholland wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 3:38 pm
crumpart wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 3:06 pm
jast wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 2:44 pm
Number two: you have a strong tendency in your vocals of smearing the pitches, i.e. at the start of the note you need some time to "warm up" to the right pitch. This is partially due to technique, but it's also habit. Simply by doing some occasional practicing hitting notes faster (without trying too hard, of course), you can do a lot to change that, to the point where it will be more of a conscious decision to smear pitches and not do it just because it's what you always do.
I know I’m not even in this fight, but this is something I tend to do as well and I’ve been trying to figure out how to not. If anyone’s got any more specific advice or exercises, I would greatly appreciate it.
I do this, too. The best exercise I know for this is to sing scales or arpeggios starting in a comfortable range and move up chromatically until I start hearing or feeling the slide up to the target pitch. E.g., sing a C major chord up to the octave and back down on a repeating syllable, then C# major, D major, etc. It seems to happen more on the higher notes when I don’t start with enough support and have to add tension to reach the pitch. It helps to have an honest third party like a teacher listening, or to record yourself and listen back to it. I don’t do this nearly enough myself, which is probably why I’m a pretty inconsistent and eternally intermediate singer.
I appreciate this advice. I tried singing along to an instrumental melody last time, but I couldn't even get close to it. In this week's song, as usual, the vocal melody is developed intuitively, and I have no idea what notes I'm singing, or supposed to be singing. I think I may have even farther to go and more to learn than some of you suspect.
User avatar
mholland
Somebody Get Me A Doctor
Posts: 107
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2020 8:18 pm
Instruments: Saxophones
Recording Method: Scarlett 2i2/Tascam FireOne, Logic
Submitting as: Night Sky
Pronouns: he/him
Location: Davis, CA

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by mholland »

lichenthroat wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 4:57 pm
I appreciate this advice. I tried singing along to an instrumental melody last time, but I couldn't even get close to it. In this week's song, as usual, the vocal melody is developed intuitively, and I have no idea what notes I'm singing, or supposed to be singing. I think I may have even farther to go and more to learn than some of you suspect.
That’s why practice outside of the context of songs is important. Those of us who started our musical journeys in school or with lessons have spent a ton of time playing or singing exercises out of method books, which helps to develop technique and an ear for pitch. To some degree this translates across instruments or from instruments to voice. If you have a hard time matching pitches, then practice doing so with long, sustained tones, work on simple scales and intervals. And if you have the resources, consider getting a teacher.
Last edited by mholland on Wed Dec 02, 2020 6:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Night Sky is Sally on lyrics, Steve on drums, and Matt on the other stuff
User avatar
jb
Hot for Teacher
Posts: 4079
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 10:12 am
Instruments: Guitar, Cello, Keys, Uke, Vox, Perc
Recording Method: Logic X
Submitting as: The John Benjamin Band
Pronouns: He/Him
Location: WASHINGTON, DC
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by jb »

Mi mi mi MI mi mi miiiiiii
La la la LA la la laaaaaa
Fay fay fay FAY fay fay faaaaay
Pa pa pa PA pa pa paaaaaaaa
blippity blop ya don’t stop heyyyyyyyyy
User avatar
mholland
Somebody Get Me A Doctor
Posts: 107
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2020 8:18 pm
Instruments: Saxophones
Recording Method: Scarlett 2i2/Tascam FireOne, Logic
Submitting as: Night Sky
Pronouns: he/him
Location: Davis, CA

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by mholland »

You put it so much more succinctly than me, jb.
Night Sky is Sally on lyrics, Steve on drums, and Matt on the other stuff
User avatar
crumpart
Panama
Posts: 942
Joined: Wed Aug 07, 2019 8:04 am
Instruments: Fuzz
Submitting as: Hot Pink Halo
Pronouns: She/her
Location: Cork, Ireland
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by crumpart »

mholland wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:59 pm
lichenthroat wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 4:57 pm
I appreciate this advice. I tried singing along to an instrumental melody last time, but I couldn't even get close to it. In this week's song, as usual, the vocal melody is developed intuitively, and I have no idea what notes I'm singing, or supposed to be singing. I think I may have even farther to go and more to learn than some of you suspect.
That’s why practice outside of the context of songs is important. Those of us who started our musical journeys in school or with lessons have spent a ton of time playing or singing exercises out of method books, which helps to develop technique and an ear for pitch. To some degree this translates across instruments or from instruments to voice. If you have a hard time matching pitches, then practice doing so with long, sustained tones, work on simple scales and intervals. And if you have the resources, consider getting a teacher.
I like to do my first couple of takes with a tuner held up in front of my face so that I can at least be sure I’m starting in the right ballpark, especially if I’ve been doing other music stuff that day and my ears are tired. I have decent relative pitch, but that means if I start a half step too sharp, everything else following that in the phrase will also be a half step too sharp.
Devil’s got me Lindt! Devil’s got me Lindt!
User avatar
the panna cotta army
Somebody Get Me A Doctor
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 11:35 am
Instruments: egg shaker (Grade 2)
Recording Method: Studio One 4
Submitting as: the pannacotta army
Location: Kent, UK

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by the panna cotta army »

j$ wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 3:31 pm
No, just about 20 years out of date.
You're objecting to things because they're a few years old or take their influence from things a few years old?
So write off everything that happened prior to 2000 then
j$ wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 3:31 pm
I would politely ask you to please take the time to understand overall criticism over before you weigh in on personal criticism again.
okay whatever you say precious, I won't mention your supercilious, pompous manner again if you don't post anymore attention-seeking, worthless reviews
j$
Beat It
Posts: 5238
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 11:33 am
Instruments: Bass, keyboards, singin', guitar
Submitting as: Johnny Cashpoint
Location: London, Engerllaaannnddd
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by j$ »

I'll ignore your comments as they don't really make much sense, even within the context of this thread, and let's each assume instead the other is massively dim and move on. So, I'll offer you a one time deal, I'll stop reviewing your dreadful songs when you stop submitting them. Offer expires one day ago.

How's Tier 3 treating you? i do hope you are taking all sensible precautions....
User avatar
jast
Ice Cream Man
Posts: 1286
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:03 pm
Instruments: Vocals, guitar
Recording Method: REAPER, Steinberg UR44
Submitting as: Jan Krueger
Location: near Aachen, Germany
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by jast »

mholland wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:59 pm
That’s why practice outside of the context of songs is important. Those of us who started our musical journeys in school or with lessons have spent a ton of time playing or singing exercises out of method books, which helps to develop technique and an ear for pitch.
I disagree with this.

Exercises have their place, of course. But all of our learning is context-based, and if you spend most of your time doing exercises removed from the actual song, it can be extremely hard actually tying that back into real performances. This is why I very much preferred exercises based on songs. Take a phrase you struggle with. Try it a few times without the lyrics on a few different vowels. Try it with the original vowels but remove some of the consonants. Notice which places are harder without the consonants and which are easier, that gives you better ideas of what specifically is causing you trouble. Gradually morph from a simplified version of the phrase to the real thing. Go back and forth. Whatever helps!

To get an ear for pitch, I think the most effective (but also potentially the most frustrating) way is to rapidly switch between recording yourself doing a phrase, and listening to the recording. This way you separate the actual doing from the spotting the mistakes - doing both at the same time is more challenging. On the flip side it lays bare all of your singing flaws, so you need to be able to cope with that. That said, a lot of pitchiness in singing is not due to not having the ear (most people who can't hit notes have no trouble telling when someone else's music is out of tune, even if they may not be able to tell what exactly is wrong) but due to flaws in technique that make it hard to control your vocal pitch - and to get that control, you'll likely end up compensating for your mistakes with workarounds, making it even harder overall. This is how you end up adopting a vocal technique that is technically (mostly) on pitch but either your voice wears out quickly, or it sounds weak, or both. Can't be helped unfortunately, unless you are willing to invest a lot of time (and probably money).

Finally, none of these exercises on their own will magically let you develop technique if you don't already have good technique. For developing technique, there is just no substitute to direct feedback from someone who knows all of the mistakes, knows how to detect them, and can advise you on what to work on and how. I've been taking lessons for a rather long time now and there seems to be no end to things I'm doing wrong that I'm having a hard time even detecting on my own. Some minor mistakes can have a huge impact, and some things (even major ones) you'll just never notice because it's simply always been that way for you.

Side note - based on that I strongly recommend against spending money on books or pre-packaged training courses (except to satisfy your curiosity). They're not going to help as much as the advertising suggests. In fact, they probably won't help very much at all.
most of my music
Song Fight-related stuff I host: ZIP archives // Circle of Titles
Jefff
Push Comes to Shove
Posts: 386
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2004 1:23 pm
Submitting as: PPV
Location: Denver, CO, US
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by Jefff »

Title idea: "Victim of Song"
User avatar
BoffoYux
Mean Street
Posts: 689
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:22 pm
Instruments: Keys, Clunking, SFX and Strings
Recording Method: Audacity, Adobe, and other 'A' titled software
Submitting as: Boffo Yux Dudes
Location: New England
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by BoffoYux »

The Listening Party for 'Disembodied Voice' will be on Monday 12/7 at 9pm EST. Might be delayed a bit because of work timing issues, but we'll have it with the new SpinTunes Winter Warm Up #1. I might forgo the West Coast Feed if we end up with 50 songs.

Excited to play so much new music on Monday!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfjGO3J7Qeg
Last edited by BoffoYux on Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
ken
Hot for Teacher
Posts: 3729
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 6:10 pm
Instruments: Guitar, bass, drums, keys
Recording Method: MOTU 828x, Cubase 10
Submitting as: Ken's Super Duper Band 'n Stuff
Pronouns: he/him
Location: oakland, ca
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by ken »

lichenthroat wrote:
Wed Dec 02, 2020 4:57 pm
I appreciate this advice. I tried singing along to an instrumental melody last time, but I couldn't even get close to it. In this week's song, as usual, the vocal melody is developed intuitively, and I have no idea what notes I'm singing, or supposed to be singing. I think I may have even farther to go and more to learn than some of you suspect.
This is why they call it practice. You have to keep working on this to get better at it. Ear training is one of the most challenging parts of being a better musician.

Pitch matching seems to be something you could work on. I used to do a couple of drills to develop this skill:

1. play each note of a scale slowly and match the pitch with your voice. So, start on C, then D, etc. Start slow and long and speed up.
2. play each interval and match both notes. So, play a C and then a D, then C and D#, then C and E. Work your way all the way up to C again, practicing the octave jump.

All of this is to say that I struggle with it as well, but the more I try to pick out my vocal melodies and then produce them with my voice, the better my vocals get. If you can't get the whole melody, break it down into a few notes at a time.

I also agree that taking voice lessons with a professional instructor is incredibly valuable. I did this a number of years ago now, and my vocals improved immediately. With the increased amount of remote lessons available, they seem even less expensive and more accessible. (Check out Fiverr!)

Good luck! I think you have a cool voice, and the more you can control it the better it will get.
Ken's Super Duper Band 'n Stuff - Berkeley Social Scene - Tiny Robots - Seamus Collective - Semolina Pilchards - Cutie Pies - Explino! - Bravo Bros. - 2 from 14 - and more!

i would just like to remind everyone that Ken eats kittens - blue lang
Jefff
Push Comes to Shove
Posts: 386
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2004 1:23 pm
Submitting as: PPV
Location: Denver, CO, US
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by Jefff »

ken wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:18 am
2. play each interval and match both notes. So, play a C and then a D, then C and D#, then C and E. Work your way all the way up to C again, practicing the octave jump.
This seems like a great exercise for more than vocals. When I'm recording lead guitar or a keyboard melody, I just stumble around the notes until I find something I like. I've wished for a while that I could hear the melody I want before playing it.
User avatar
ujnhunter
Ice Cream Man
Posts: 1657
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 1:09 pm
Instruments: Bass, Keyboards, Crummy Guitar & Animal Noises (especially Donkeys)
Recording Method: Reaper 5.9x, Tascam FireOne/Behringer UMC202HD/Avid Eleven Rack/Line 6 UX2, Win 7 PC / Win 10 Laptop
Submitting as: Cock, Chth*.*, D.A.H. (Der Alter Hahn)
Pronouns: His Infernal Majesty
Location: CT, USA
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by ujnhunter »

Maybe we need a new thread for the Vocal Training stuff... but I've always been interested in trying to figure out my range or at least figure out what is my comfortable range, so that I could better write melodies for my voice... Not sure exactly how to go about it, but I figure maybe doing something like what Ken talks about above... Writing a bunch of MIDI notes going from C to D# etc... Octave by octave and recording your voice to that... to see where you start to struggle to hit notes consistently...
-Ujn Hunter
Photovoltaik - Free 6 Track EP - Song Fight! Liner Notes
Billy's Little Trip wrote:I must have this....in my mouth.....now.
User avatar
Sober
Ice Cream Man
Posts: 1646
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 10:40 am
Instruments: Mandolin, hammond, dobro
Recording Method: Pro Tools 12.5
Location: Houston, TX

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by Sober »

This is past being funny.

Critique of art doesn't require that one be a master artist. This all pretty plainly falls short of critique, though, and one might try to be aware of how glassy his glass house is when hurling stones at everyone else.

Seriously j$ - I've been interacting with you for nearly 20 years, and I've never seen anything like this from you. Are you ok? I ask sincerely.
🤠
mo
Push Comes to Shove
Posts: 358
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 9:46 pm
Instruments: guitar, bass
Recording Method: behringer umc202hd, Bias FX, Reaper
Submitting as: duboce triangle, agony sauce, moody vermin, spite, yaks
Pronouns: n/a
Location: hell a

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by mo »

Jefff wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:16 am
ken wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:18 am
2. play each interval and match both notes. So, play a C and then a D, then C and D#, then C and E. Work your way all the way up to C again, practicing the octave jump.
This seems like a great exercise for more than vocals. When I'm recording lead guitar or a keyboard melody, I just stumble around the notes until I find something I like. I've wished for a while that I could hear the melody I want before playing it.
Do you ever sing what you want to hear first and then figure it out on the instrument? It occurs to me that you probably do hear melodies you want and that what you're describing is a sort of *translation* problem, but you tell me, I might not be getting what you're saying.
User avatar
Spud
Hot for Teacher
Posts: 4755
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:25 am
Instruments: Bass, Keyboards, eHorn
Submitting as: Octothorpe
Location: Seattle
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by Spud »

mo wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:43 pm
Do you ever sing what you want to hear first and then figure it out on the instrument?
This is the only way I've ever done it.
"I only listen to good music. And Octothorpe." - Marcus Kellis
Song Fight! The Rockening
User avatar
jb
Hot for Teacher
Posts: 4079
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 10:12 am
Instruments: Guitar, Cello, Keys, Uke, Vox, Perc
Recording Method: Logic X
Submitting as: The John Benjamin Band
Pronouns: He/Him
Location: WASHINGTON, DC
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by jb »

This is apparently how Rivers Cuomo comes up with guitar solos.
Spud wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:51 pm
mo wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:43 pm
Do you ever sing what you want to hear first and then figure it out on the instrument?
This is the only way I've ever done it.
blippity blop ya don’t stop heyyyyyyyyy
User avatar
jpnickolas
Ain't Talkin' 'Bout Love
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2020 4:46 pm
Instruments: guitar
Recording Method: UMC202HD, Reaper
Submitting as: JP Nickolas
Pronouns: he/him
Location: Seattle, WA
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by jpnickolas »

I got good at whistling for this reason. I can more easily whistle out a lead part than sing it. Translating it to guitar or keyboard becomes its own fun/excruciating exercise. The bits lost in translation often end up morphing into a killer and much more interesting riff.
User avatar
jb
Hot for Teacher
Posts: 4079
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 10:12 am
Instruments: Guitar, Cello, Keys, Uke, Vox, Perc
Recording Method: Logic X
Submitting as: The John Benjamin Band
Pronouns: He/Him
Location: WASHINGTON, DC
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by jb »

Whistle battle!
jpnickolas wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:40 pm
I got good at whistling for this reason. I can more easily whistle out a lead part than sing it. Translating it to guitar or keyboard becomes its own fun/excruciating exercise. The bits lost in translation often end up morphing into a killer and much more interesting riff.
blippity blop ya don’t stop heyyyyyyyyy
owl
Panama
Posts: 904
Joined: Mon May 15, 2017 1:29 pm
Instruments: vox keys uke guitar
Recording Method: REAPER
Submitting as: Vowl Sounds, miscellaneous owl
Pronouns: she/her
Location: Madison, WI
Contact:

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by owl »

If we have a vocal techniques thread, I hope we can also have a learn to whistle thread bc I want to learn how and my whistling sucks
mo
Push Comes to Shove
Posts: 358
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 9:46 pm
Instruments: guitar, bass
Recording Method: behringer umc202hd, Bias FX, Reaper
Submitting as: duboce triangle, agony sauce, moody vermin, spite, yaks
Pronouns: n/a
Location: hell a

Re: What was that? (Disembodied Voice reviews)

Post by mo »

I also cannot whistle
Post Reply