Time to hand out the Ribbons, it's the Pink Reviews

GlennCase · Post by **GlennCase** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:12 pm

jeff robertson wrote:
feldspar wrote:Flvxxvm Florvm: I like everything about this except your vocal delivery. The harmonica is a very nice touch, and the guitar's got it just right. Maybe this could use some more percussion. The echoey hard-panned kick drum and the sparse handclaps don't carry this tune as much as they should.
That drum sound is actually just what the mic picks up when I pound on the base of the mic stand with my fist.

Kick ass, Beavis!!!

edit: Whoops, this is Combustion, not Glenn. I'm at his house, watching him masturbate.

Paco Del Stinko · Post by **Paco Del Stinko** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:24 pm

Minty - I'm glad you enjoyed the riff, it was a fun one to play. There's something kind of wrong about it, but it still works. Thanks!

jack · Post by **jack** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:56 pm

starfinger wrote: And my name is not starfighter. that would be ridiculous.

-craig

well, you did create what is arguably the most beloved song in the history of songfight, so it's not that much of a stretch.

Paco Del Stinko · Post by **Paco Del Stinko** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 10:07 pm

Some of this reminded me of early four-track days. Many a fade-out in here for the wary!

BLT w/ PDS - I like the main riff and sqeeze on me lines best. Good groove also. I think the vocals are better when you push them a bit and they are occasionally unclear from the delay. Good cruising rocker.

Chuck The Bear - Very 70's radio. The key chords are perfect. Very nice end section that helps sink the melodies in. Good tune.

CSize and ESpoons - I like the pace of this initially, although it starts to feel a bit draggy after a time. A little colder than some recent ones, the changes are heady at times and get a little spooky. Some interesting ground, I like the prettier parts best.

Dave Vs. Mandy - Fun and well put together. The ping-pongy thing pleases me also. Good work.

The Disciples Of Beer - I like the intro bass line and hipster attempt. Turn the noodles into wah and use it for porn soundtrack. I like the neighborhood this hangs out in.

DM6 - Some of this works very well and has nice swampy feel. Nice change. The vocals aren't bad but need a bit more threat to them or something. A little less nice guy sounding maybe. The rhythm catches on to itself pretty well and the slide sells it best.

The Fault - The progression is nice and dark with some nice chord changes. The flangy sound is almost too much at times, for me, but fits in very well. The vocals work mostly, and I like the flat affect. Maybe some high accents to make it both spookier and break up the pattern a bit.

Feldspar - Nicely done and pleasant sounding. I like the cycle that you go through although the ending feels like it arrives early. Nice song that might not suffer from a little nugget tacked on.

Flvxxm Florvm - Nice swampy vibe here. The vocal works more than it doesn't, and the guitar performance is very good. I think what works best here is the approach to the recording that resulted in some real feel.

Gawking Urethras - I like this combo. The guitar work is excellent and played effortlessly. Phil, I love your voice and where you go and try to go, but I think you would benefit best from the immediate feedback of working with someone that can help you bang some stuff into place better: note a little off, hold back here a little, etc. A producer, I guess. Nice and tasty guitar lead.

Hostess Mostess - Very glad to hear you again. This may not be crispy tight, but the sunny air is very nice. Nice melody and progressions, the bridge is excellent and a nice fit, good build. Good song, stick around!

Klownhole - This is great. I love the progression in the beginning and despite some unclear vocals and performance early on, I thought some of the lyrics were very good, at least when the ribbon is awarded. The change could not be any more huger. I feel 800 feet tall and like I'm dragging my feet through a muck of destruction. Beautiful. I like this one a lot.

LSares - That guitar riff and progression are way fun. The vocal ideas are good even if too self-consciously performed. I like the energy here otherwise.

Masterhyde - I like your voice the easy-going tune. I think either a different voice or rhythmic delivery, used as a bridge type affair, might be neat. Casual, I'd like to hear you get all Mr. Smoothy!

MC Eric B - The music is solid and appropriate. The vocal delivery could use a few more practice runs. Not killing me. Also: not killing me.

Meeska Chaukinov - Like a soundscape to the back alley of some latex-clad society. The vocal delivery works well when it sounds all secretive, less so when speaking up. I like the bass.

Melvin - Nice big chorus, I like them better than the verses overall. The lead section is nice and dark, unlike your production which is clearer every time I hear it. I like the bass line, but wonder if the same one played smoother wouldn't help the verses a bit. Nice work.

Mike Lamb - Though inconsistently delivered, the vocals still get some feel across. Oddly, they remind me of Roger Waters! I like the riding of the one chord here. Nice mood.

Mr. Lostman f/ B. Ellison - Sounds like a good scratchpad to be worked on later. Not unpleasant, it musters some energy and is performed decently.

Paco - Let's dance!

Paul Moyer - Good build and layers. Doesn't quite race off the cliff, but starts revving the engines. Loose attitude.

R Mosquito - I like the down shift in the beginning. The vocals could come up even if they are wacko. Not as crazy as it could be, there are still some interesting digital noises.

Starfinger - Great groove and vocals, this is packed with great textures and layers. Silly but that's fine with the delivery. Good fun.

Thornberry - A mash-up of theatre and 60's rock. Good vocal lines and perfect lead for this. Good changes with subtle touches. The end feels a bit incomplete, but good ambitious work.

Zipline - Zipline keeps getting better. The progression starts as a fine jam progression and has some nice evolutions pass through it. Some great guitar and drumming, the manic sprint at the end hints at exciting possibilities. Loose fun.

Billy's Little Trip · Post by **Billy's Little Trip** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 1:39 am

MintyHandy wrote: Billy's Little Trip, congrats on the production level bump -- much, much better, sounds fantastic.

Thanks for noticing. I'm still figuring things out, but I'm having a good time with my new stuff.

Paco Del Stinko wrote: BLT w/ PDS - I like the main riff and sqeeze on me lines best. Good groove also. I think the vocals are better when you push them a bit and they are occasionally unclear from the delay. Good cruising rocker.

I really wanted to push my vox, but I was sick at time and I couldn't quite hit the level I wanted. I need to back off the vocal delay a bit.
Thanks for the rip'n solo Charlie, I love your style. Oh, and thanks for the comments.

feldspar wrote: Billy's Little Trip with guest star Paco Del Stinko: The guitar and bass work well. Vocal effects fit well. Your delivery is good too, though you break your cadence on a few phrases, like "innocent face to keep her minx hidden." I think lyrically you could've phrased it to flow a little better. Solid effort, though.

Yeah, I tried it a few ways, but got stuck on rhyming the word "pink" when I really didn't have to. Thanks feldspar.

wages · Post by **wages** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:46 am

Paco Del Stinko wrote:Gawking Urethras - I like this combo. The guitar work is excellent and played effortlessly. Phil, I love your voice and where you go and try to go, but I think you would benefit best from the immediate feedback of working with someone that can help you bang some stuff into place better: note a little off, hold back here a little, etc. A producer, I guess. Nice and tasty guitar lead.

I totally agree. I should really get a collection of songs ready, then get a producer and some studio time.... and a band. I've always thought "if I could just have someone here to get me a little direction...". I've been thinking of seeing a vocal trainer (there's a local one who toured with the Bee Gees) to help me work out the kinks.

I may have written the music, but King Arthur takes ALL the credit for the great sound and the effortless playing.

drë · Post by **drë** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:30 pm

Pink Ribbon REVIEWS:

Billy's Little Trip with guest star Paco Del Stinko :
you always know how to start out a good song. good riffs, great guitar tone. kicking drums. liking it. the guitar solo is a bit of a wanking, but is still solid, i liked better the break with the rolling bass and drums(a much needed change). the nature of your vocals, just makes its sound like your struggling to sing over all the distornion going on here. still one of top entries. ohh yeah, i barely could make out any of the lyrics...that’s probably why it seemed a bit long.

Chuck The Bear : Glenn the songfight pop ballad mastermind. there's a bit of FBF "last date" lyrics in here... i really really like the barebones of this song( lyrics/chords/melody).. just wishing the production was different. more like Sixpence None The Richer "kiss me"...
if i was to produce this song for you, to make it the way i hear it in my head. I would have given you a 12 string guitar, (not too bright, maybe even flat tuning to give it a more saddpy feel), and replace the accompany lead guitar melody with an accordion, while keeping drums to a minimum snare/kick/high hat, with brushes. love your songwriting, our production styles are just different that’s all. keep it up.
i know not much of review, just my thoughts.

Cynthia Size and the @eclectic sp00ns :
you definitely have establish your own style. not sure how to review this. ummm, more creativity need ?

DM6 : enjoyed some of the dirty blues/rock feel of this. didn’t keep my attention for too long thought. no engaging lyrics.

Diciples of Beer: liked the bass line on my right ear. doodling on the left ear is stupid and annoying. too much panning. Simplicity my have been better, with just finger snapping, bass line, and voices. no panning.

Dave vs. Mandy : i enjoyed this. props for the experimentation, well executed.

Feldspar : your vocals sound better than ever. always appreciate you minimalist acoustic approach. the BBUZZZZ is freaking annoying.

Flvxxvm Florvm : ohh dude, i love this. i have try to record songs with this style many times before, you pull it off the way i wish i could.
love the guitar tone, moodiness, harmonica, kick drum, and slap on the knee.. very fun. need water ? possible vote.
here's an example of what i sound like when i try to record a song like this. i envy you.
http://www.songfight.org/music/texas/an ... _tejas.mp3

Gawking Urethras : i like this, and idea behind it. its rough in a couple of places and a tad long. wages vocals only get better with time. and KA production is good. reminds me of some song heard on top 40 radio, (stone sour?).. gotta say that guitar so by KA is sweeeettttt... trim the intro and ending, have longer guitar solo.

Hostess Mostess : good song like always. a bit of 80's sappy ballad. dammit i think is missing 1 more instrument to get it over the hump to make it a great song.. just not sure what. possible vote.

Klownhole : this is ONE "get you foot tapping" song... a bit long.. i highly enjoyed this none the lesss.. ahh whatttt is thisssss, my eaaaarrrrsssss, whhhaaaaattt, i tttaaakeee it baccckkkk, i taaaakkeeee it bacccck,,,...whattttt is thiiiisissssss????? aahhhhhhhgggg.. makeeee it stoppp ,
makeeee it stoooooooppppp.
next.

LSares : cool beat, cool riff... vocals could improve. good accompany bass. great idea for a song, lacking energy in the performance.

MC Eric B : wow talk about mix feeling on this one. was loving the piano/guitar intro, and then comes the nerd cord rapping style and i was like awwww crappp. but then the lyrics really cought my attention. love the lyrics and emotions on this, if your not a father then i'll say your a good writer and performer. possible vote.

Masterhyde : yo! smooth! no doubt! liked this. thats some smooth rapping, AND ITS NOT NERDCORD! YIPI!!!... this is actually really good and sweet. possible vote.

Meeshka Chaukinov : who needs music when you have noise. oh here come the music (i think)... props for the creativiy and innovative stuff. tooo long, for my attention.

Melvin : took me a while to catch on to your style. poppy, but you do it well. your verses are always better than your choruses, vocally you sound flat on the chorus, or just not enough power to get the screams across. you sound fine on the verses, just the choruses gives you problems. instruments/ production are great.

Mike Lamb : don't cry for me Argentina? ohhhh i'll take that joke back... this is good, once the entire band comes in. like the drums on this.
could have use a change or two. Possible vote.

Mr. Lostman feat b. ellison : poppy, poppy, poppy... not bad. This has a live feel to it. actually, i have live version of razorlight's golden touch and it sounds allot like this. this pretty good song actually, wished it had better production.

Paco Del Stinko : sounds like nothing else i listen to around here. Defanatly distinct, and good. dude you have a genera of your own. props for that. possible vote.

Paul Moyer :...................... 30 seconds to get started hey ? i want them back. once it actually gets going around 1:15 there’s allot of good rock energy, unfourtanly it lacks direction. sounds like a hell of a jam.

R. Mosquito : i was so glad to see your name back on the list. liked what you had done before. this is somewhat a disappointment. i guess you have completely lost your mind, well at least you have your archives.

Starfinger : get the funk out! fun, gooffy, and danceable like always. one of the few songfighters that knows how to mix music (instruments) with random noises(fx).. should be an example. hahahahah, funny lyrics too. possible vote.

The Fault : i like this. why do i think of regina spektor? moody music, vocals are not too bad. could of use a better mix, as vocals get lost sometimes. possible vote.

Thornberry : dirty and grindy guitar tone... yeahhh. like this, and the vocal approach of scccree mmminnng, one word at a time. wished there was more bass on the mix, nice little piano touch. there’s a bit of guitar wanking.. good change/break, even better ending. this is good. possible vote. but seriously dude, more bass!

Zipline : you guys can come up with some pretty good happy prog rock/jazzy stuff. like this. sounds like fun song to see being performed live.
but unfurtunately sitting here at my desk, i wished there was better production out of this. fun fun song though.

My vote is between,
starfinger, paco, Thornberry, MC eric, and Flvxxvm.
Umm thought choise.
MC Eric gets it for the pretty lyrics.

MC Eric B · Post by **MC Eric B** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 8:58 pm

No, I am not a father.

---------------------
MC Eric B : wow talk about mix feeling on this one. was loving the piano/guitar intro, and then comes the nerd cord rapping style and i was like awwww crappp. but then the lyrics really cought my attention. love the lyrics and emotions on this, if your not a father then i'll say your a good writer and performer. possible vote.
---------------------

- Eric

SteveHandPuppet · Post by **SteveHandPuppet** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 9:25 pm

I must be in a bad mood tonight

Billy's Little Trip: This seems fairly well produced throughout, except for the overdriven vocals. Perhaps a little ButtRock-y for my tastes but that's OK. Good job.

Disciples of Beer: This is pretty half-assed. Sorry. Bring something full-assed next time plzkthx.

Fault: The drum sequencing is driving me batty. There's an obnoxious static glitch throughout the chorus. It sounds like it's intentional/sequenced, but it was just driving me to look if my cellphone was interfering with the sound card. I'm not liking all the synthetic stuff, but that's a matter of taste.

Klownhole: This is a bit corny and sloppy. Given the length, why does it need to repeat everything 2-3 times? The nightmarish heavy second half doesn't do much to make this any more interesting. And it keeps going. And going. And going.

MasterHyde: This sounds just like the last couple weeks. And just like the last couple of weeks, I'm disqualifying myself from reviewing because I don't understand this aesthetic.

MC Eric B: Eject!

Meeshka Chaukinov:No thank you!

Mr. Lostman: Sweet! Shame on all the rest of you guys for not being anywhere near as good as this. Nice powerpop songwriting, performance, recording. Mix is not bad. My only bone to pick would be with the cymbol crash in my right ear sticking out.

Paco del Stinko: Hmm. I just seems like this song is simply a delivery mechanism for the one riff and the ring modulator effect. Well recorded and mixed, but the song itself is too slight.

Chuck the Bear: Something about this makes me think this should be sung and played more in the style of Icecream Hands. The fuzz guitar [is this just a processed version of the acoustic track?] is really thin sounding and doesn't really fit with this. I think it would work better with something a bit beefier and not strictly doubling the acoustic, with a more distinct stereo image.

Cynthia Size and please mommy make the pain stop: n/c

DM6: Wait, I think we've just found the Disciple of Beer's other ass-half. See above.

Feldspar: This is OK for GNG, but nothing particularly unique.

Flvxxvm Florvm: Not a fan of the Delta Blues thing. I can't tell if it's for real or not.

Gawking Urethras: Ick. Grunge Ballads were an abomination in the 90's as well.

Hostess Mostess: All I can think of is Phil Collins. I don't think I can listen all the way through.

LSares: This is alright. The mix feels kind of congested, though, with everything clogging up the mids or something. I don't mind the minimalist sort of new wavy thing.

Melvin: Very cool. This sort of sounds like Weezer ripping off...Weezer. The mix is great. The guitars are nicely separated and have distinct positions in the stereo field. There's lots of nice bits hidden here and there to keep interest up. Excellent vocal harmonizing etc. I like this a lot. 'gratz.

My Clam: I like the performance and recording. This mix is not bad either. The lyrics and vocals maybe not so much, but overall a solid job.

Paul Moyer: This is pretty straightforward, except for all the voices. I like the overall performance, recording and mix, except that it does get a bit oversaturated when the guitar goes thick. And the overlapping voices clog it up in the middle. I think this could have been a contender.

Starfinger: This is funny enough. I just wish it had real music and not all the synthesized stuff. I gotta give you points for the multiple references to your "wee-wee", but I'm pretty immature that way. This would have been better a capella.

Dave vs. Mandy: This is an ok gimmick for one listen.

R. Mosquito: This is not an ok gimmick for one listen.

Thornberry: I can dig it. I like the rocking lo-fi feel to this. Good performance. The recording and mix is good; it feels like the vintage 60's lo-fi sound is intentional and not just the result of crappy technique or equipment. Something about this reminds me of Young Fresh Fellows, and that is high praise indeed. Good job.

Zipline: This has a lot of good things going on, but suffers a bit from poor recording, pops on the vocals. The mix feels a bit unsettled. Something about this reminds of various Flying Nun Records acts, or maybe Pavement.

Mr Lostman, Melvin, Thornberry, Zipline advance to the next round. Vote probably goes to Mr. Lostman or Melvin.

Mike Lamb · Post by **Mike Lamb** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 12:57 am

Paco Del Stinko wrote: Mike Lamb - Though inconsistently delivered, the vocals still get some feel across. Oddly, they remind me of Roger Waters! I like the riding of the one chord here. Nice mood.

I will take that as what I hope is intended as a compliment..

I love Roger Waters' vocals, and he is definitely one of my major musical influences. It is nice to get a review that's a bit more useful than "vocals too loud" or "vocals too quiet." Thanks!

-Mike

Mike Lamb · Post by **Mike Lamb** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 1:43 am

Sorry for the formatting. I wrote these over the last couple days. If I missed anybody, please let me know. Nothing personal, I just lost track.

Chuck the Bear

Initial impression, prog rock, like an old school Genesis song, but it gets really muddy.
Can't hear most of the vocals. Good drums.. needs some EQ I think. Sounds really "busy" below
500Hz, but really thin in the vocals. Nice doubled vox, weird envelope filtered guitar lead, but
fits the song. Good track, just needs some EQ to bring the vox out more.

Gawking Urethras

Initial impression: didn't expect much from the name, VERY pleasantly surprised. GREAT vocals.
This reminds me of the intro to a Danzig song. It's got a huge buildup, but alas never breaks through
into the ROCK. The hi-hat that comes in around halfway through sounds very mechanical and contrived.
This would have been a lot better without that tss tss tss tss. Awesome solo!! Perfect fit into the
song. Nice effects on it too. Great bass, clean, out in front, but not at all distorted, and it never
collides with the vocals. Very nice job.

DM6

First impression: seemed mixed too hot.. I had to turn the volume down. Very busy mix, lots of stuff
all over the place, but somehow it's working. Reminds me a lot of old ZZ Top stuff. Cool guitar
work, but it is all on the left. I think some of that solo work needs to be more up in front, center
stage, soundwise. This is some great guitar work, and it definitely makes up for some lackluster
vocals. I was listening to the guitar work so much I barely even registered the singing. You might
benefit from doing a pass-off, where you sing a line, then play a huge guitar lick, and back
and forth. The vocals are good, but seriously overshadowed by the guitar.

Dave vs Mandy

First impression: Eep Opp Ork Ah AH. Cute toy-based loop. Nice work making all the machine
vox line up. Not really my thing, but nice job.

Disciples of Beer

First impressions: BASS! Yes. Awesome noodling guitar. Snaps are perfect. Hmm. I wish the snaps had
kept going, the song totally lost cohesion when the snaps & vox stopped. I would suggest cutting the
mids, maybe 880-950Hz by 10dB or so to clean up the huge bass saturation. This is a good track.

Mike Lamb

Me.. I thought this turned out pretty well. The solo sucks. Oh well!

Thornberry

First impression: Guitars sound very compressed. Everything sounds compressed. Killer solo, but the
whole song sounds like it's 4k-7k boosted or something. It kinda made my ears hurt, but the final
solo was pretty huge. You have some serious talent, don't hide your light under weird compression
and EQ.

Paul Moyer

First impression: Kinda dull. You build into a pretty well textured song, but there's just no
oomph. At the end, I can't understand the lyrics, and it's just the same drone as the intro.
Good song, but I really wish you'd spent a little time making the lyrics more engaging.

MC Eric B

You are improving. Not my thing, not my style, no interest in the content, but it's a an order of
magnitude better than your previous entry. Listen to Masterhyde's tracks and try to get your vocals
to sit down in the mix a little more so they sound more integrated.

Klownhole

Felt like I came in halfway through the song. It has a nice little boppy theme, but then it
degenerates into a cacophony of weirdness. I stopped listening about halfway through.

Flvxxvm Flovm

Weird, another ZZ Top kinda thing. I guess this theme spoke to gravelly clipped vocals. Nice effort,
but the vocals were hard for me to understand. Good song, but I like to understand the vocals.

Melvin

Finally, a straight up rocker. Great harmony! Damn, this gets better.. This reminds me a lot of
some of my favorite Boltoph tracks. This is really really good. Possible vote.

Mr. Lostman f. B. Ellison

Not really my thing.. kinda repetative. No hook for me. Sounds muffled.. coulda used a little
boost on the high end.

LSares

I am not sure, but I think we may have The Beat (We got the Beat). Bring the vocal levels up!
If you're playing a progression in a major key, don't solo in a minor, relative minor, or
anything resembling a minor key!! This would have been OK if the vocals/solo/guitar noodle
hadn't been totally out of key or out of tune. Maybe that's what you were going for though?
I dunno, but it felt very dissonant to me.

Hostess Mostess

First impression: Best of Show.. This is really excellent. I wish the piano part was a little
more interesting. The middle part is very John Lennon. This is excellent work, possible vote.

Paco del Stinko

Intro is a little long for Songfight. Wait, I'm confused.. are you Primus? Or are you Dread Zeppelin?
I'm gonna go with Dread. You have a cool sound here, and it's clear you have a lot of experience
putting it together. This is really clean, excellent recording. Exceptionally well done.. possible
vote here.

CYnthia Size

More computer vox.. good, but not my thing.

Zipline

Ouch, clipping. Instruments sound good, but the "friend" vocals sound half-assed. Pretty cool
harmonies for some parts, but they really go sour about 1/3rd in.

R. Mosquito

Mongo sings Techno! not really my thing, but the vocal delivery seems way out of context with the
"music".. although quite honestly, I am not sure I'd really quite call this "music" in the
traditional sense. Maybe industrial? Whatever it is, it's well sequenced and recorded, although
the vocals could be a little louder in the intro.

Feldspar

I love the vocals. This is the kind of track I just love to hear on Songfight. Straight up
folk/rock. Couple parts where the timing falters a little, but all in all, this is a really
nice track. Great emotion in the vox. Possible vote.

Masterhyde

Once again, you lay down the smooth jam. A perfect blend of old school 808 sound and modern R&B.
Really excellent. While I hate to argue with greatness, I do find myself compelled to ask, is
there more to Masterhyde? I'm just waiting for the debut of the wheels of steel.

Billy's Little Trip

Sweeet guitar rock. I can't understand the lyrics though! This is really making me want to do a
huge metal song. This feels like old school Ministry to me, and in a really good way. Nice job.

Starfinger

This was kinda bass overload for me, and a lot of 70s/80s soul cliches, or at least that's what
I perceived. Very well recorded, but not the type of music that interests me at all. Technically,
excellent job.

Man, this is a tough fight.. Paco? Mostess? Melvin? All heavy hitters, but soo many others that are right on the coattails. In the end, I'm going with Feldspar. Well recorded, nice arrangement, great vocal emotion, and the type of music that I enjoy. Well played, sir.

wages · Post by **wages** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 7:04 am

SteveHandPuppet wrote:Gawking Urethras: Ick. Grunge Ballads were an abomination in the 90's as well.

That brings up a question that's been playing pong in my skull for a long time (with really small paddles).... Does "Wages" music have a decidedly "90s" sound or does it have an "influenced by, but somewhat original sound", but please don't say it has "a tired old *blah* sound"? Actually, tell me whatever you think. Afterall, this IS the review thread.

Examples:
The Exies = decidely '90s STP-type sound (if I recall correctly)
The Killers = influenced by '80s, but somewhat fresh and original
nobody = you never hear signed/popular bands with a "tired old sound", right?

king_arthur · Post by **king_arthur** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:19 am

Keeping in mind, of course, that collaborating with KA is going to add another ten years to the sound of your music...

Charles (KA)

Billy's Little Trip · Fri Feb 02, 2007 10:52 am

dre wrote: Billy's Little Trip with guest star Paco Del Stinko :
you always know how to start out a good song. good riffs, great guitar tone. kicking drums. liking it. the guitar solo is a bit of a wanking, but is still solid, i liked better the break with the rolling bass and drums(a much needed change). the nature of your vocals, just makes its sound like your struggling to sing over all the distornion going on here. still one of top entries. ohh yeah, i barely could make out any of the lyrics...that’s probably why it seemed a bit long.

The vocal issue is probably what Paco said, too much delay. I'm trying to create a signature sound, but I'm hard to understand in the first place, so I should work on trying to become more audible vocally. The struggling to push the vocals out over the distortion is intensional, but I need to work on the mix to make it work better. I try to create a live feel to my studio recordings as a "style". It's actually harder to sound dirty in a digital studio than most would think. Thanks Dre, you always have a constructive review.

SteveHandPuppet wrote: Billy's Little Trip: This seems fairly well produced throughout, except for the overdriven vocals. Perhaps a little ButtRock-y for my tastes but that's OK. Good job.

Thanks for the production comment Steve, I'm still working on that. The truth is, I'm not into Butt Rock, (although instrumentally most of it rips), and never got into it when it was popular mainly because of the lyrics and the artificial image. The lyrics in this song where a bit of a sarcastic twist. I don't write about sex and breaking up hotel rooms. If I ever do, it would be way more metaphorical and romantic. I wrote the lyrics using the title, as apposed to writing a song that is inspired by the title.

Mike Lamb wrote: Billy's Little Trip
Sweeet guitar rock. I can't understand the lyrics though! This is really making me want to do a huge metal song. This feels like old school Ministry to me, and in a really good way. Nice job.

Thanks Mike, I like stuff that rocks, and I'm working on the "more audible" vox thing. When I was putting this song together, I knew there was only one ax wielding hombre for the solo on this song.

Personally, I don't know why more people aren't commenting on what a KILLER solo this song had. I absolutely love the way Charlie plays. He can run a ripping scale and add a harmonious flavor to fit the song, like the way he ended his solo, to work right back into the music. Paco Del Stinko is my guitar hero. *swoon*

wages · Post by **wages** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 4:37 pm

king_arthur wrote:Keeping in mind, of course, that collaborating with KA is going to add another ten years to the sound of your music...

Charles (KA)

While your style is obviously way different than the others I've collab'd with (Meatwad, Obscurity, Paco, etc, none of whom have a similar style by any means), I didn't get the sense that too much "age" (as I now affectionately call it) was being put into the song. I hear a little Dire Straits, but to me, they are just as fresh now as they were back in the day (honestly, I never knew they existed until the late '90s anyway, but that's another story). To my ear, you play the tunes precisely, and the solos and additional song structure you come up with have dramatically improved the tunes we've done together. I think our Sunspots entry was a great example of exactly how much better a tune can be with you behind the wheel. If my vocals had been more solid, we may have taken the cake.

But we all know I'm improving....s-l-o-w-l-y.

I'd say my musical "style" is largely influenced by southern gospel music (I grew up baptist & penecostal....uggg....the offkey type) followed by country, grunge, southern rock, with some modern rock thrown in. I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to what genres affected what aspects of the "wages sound". ha ha ha! "the wages sound"! Ohhhh, I love getting off work early and drinking really STRONG coffee!

MintyHandy · Post by **MintyHandy** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 4:48 pm

There's something kind of wrong about it, but it still works.

That "wrongness" is exactly what took it from good to excellent, and triggered the Zappa comparison.

SteveHandPuppet · Post by **SteveHandPuppet** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 11:30 pm

Wages wrote:
SteveHandPuppet wrote:Gawking Urethras: Ick. Grunge Ballads were an abomination in the 90's as well.
That brings up a question that's been playing pong in my skull for a long time (with really small paddles).... Does "Wages" music have a decidedly "90s" sound or does it have an "influenced by, but somewhat original sound", but please don't say it has "a tired old *blah* sound"? Actually, tell me whatever you think. Afterall, this IS the review thread.

I'm not going to generalize for "Wages" music, but I can speak for my reaction to this particular song.

The song conforms entirely to a specific, recognizable sub-genre; the kind of ballad commerical "grunge" bands such as Stone Temple Pilots or Pearl Jam resorted to to soften or counterbalance their (already sweetened and watered-down) "hard" grunge. [Disclaimer: I was a dyed-in-the-flannel early grunge purist (minus the flannel), so the pop-oriented "grunge" of STP, AIC, Pearl Jam, etc. sounds horribly compromised compared the "real thing" (Mudhoney, TAD, the Fluid, GasHuffer etc.)]

Anyhow, my criticism of the song is roughly the same as my criticism of this particular sub-genre; it feels like a cop-out. On the one hand, it wants to be focused on the vocal performance, yet the "rule" discards the primary, fundamental property to judge the quality of the performance: singing on key. On the one hand it wants to insulate itself from any criticism on merit but still wants "credit" for being centered around the vocal performance.

Instead it relies on vocal modulation, what I would uncharitably call "warbling and yodeling", to try to convey emotion and to provide some basis upon which to indicate the singer's "skill" and signify that the performance is intentional (and not just incompetently singing everything a half-step or so flat).

But it's a cheap trick, not unlike the "Unplugged" gimmick of the band sitting around on stools strumming acoustic guitars, playing a dumbed down, slower version of their "rock" song to make it instantly feel more "heartfelt" [another obnoxious tendency of commerical radio grungies]. It's all signifier and no content. It's substituting an easy formula to punch easy buttons for pre-programmed emotional responses. It's cynically manipulative. Or maybe I just to get laid and stop analyzing everything.

It wants to boldly reject a rule, yet timidly substitutes an easy to satisfy rule instead of taking any real chances on its own. I actually don't really care so much about "vocal performance", and a lot (probably most) of my favorite music rejects the tyranny of on-key vocals. The difference is that I think it's fine to not be perfectly on key, as long as the singer fully commits to his or her own unique style and performance and is willing to risk rejection by the mainstream listener.

Anyhow, I had hoped to convey my criticism of this song in one pithy comment. With 25 songs or so each week I don't really want to commit the time to review in depth every entry, so I tend to focus more on stuff that fits my personal aesthetic and less so on stuff that doesn't.

In the first case I can try to articulate the ways in which it succeeds or fails, because I can mentally construct an "ideal" version of the song and describe the difference from the actual version.

In the second case, the aesthetic is so far removed from mine that I can't mentally construct a version that I would want to hear for comparison without throwing the whole thing out. What advice could I give (for example) MasterHyde or Cynthia Size? Go buy an electric guitar and amp, make friends with a drummer and teach your significant other to play bass?

Somewhere in the middle would be entries like this one, Flvxxvm Florvm's, DM6's or Disciple of Beer's, [Disclaimer: I'm referring specifically to Pink Ribbon entries] which all seem to cocoon themselves in very specific, fairly rigid formulas. The tighter the formula, the less interesting it is to me. At best these would be well-executed implementations from their respective blueprints. There doesn't seem to be so much creative effort in stamping out one of these, and the potential up-side is strictly limited: yet still another grunge ballad or slide-guitar delta blues or whatever. Nothing ventured, nothing gained in my book.

I suppose this is really more about my own personal aesthetics and feelings about music, and not so much about your song.

I will endeavor to offer more constructive comments on the technical aspects of the entries, but no promises. Sometimes the temptation of the one-line zinger are too much to resist.

MintyHandy · Post by **MintyHandy** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:04 am

I’m recovering from acute bronchitis and a sinus infection (diagnosed yesterday), so I can’t promise to get through them all (and the medication may impair my judgement), but here goes.

Chuck the Bear
I like your voice, I like your lyrics, I like your sound, I like your hook, I like your solo, I like your harmonies. Nothing to complain about except loose drum timing, and everything to praise. Terrific! Songs like this make me feel that I am not very talented, but my loss is your gain, and my gain, too: into the music collection it goes. Possible vote.

The Fault
The rhymes are on the obvious side, but a credible 80s-style goth tune nonetheless. Needs a hook, but then 80s-style goth tunes never have one, do they? So points for being true to the genre.

Feldspar
I hate to think what they must be burning, to get pink smoke…a gentle song, a pleasant song, but nothing special, and awkward to suddenly have strong dual vocals on “I’m still awake”, only to have the energy dissipate immediately. Lyrics could use less poetry, more cleverness. Not bad at all. By the way, with glowing embers like that, who needs enemies? HA. HA. I AM A FUNNY GUY.

R. Mosquito
Sandpaper for the mind. I can’t hear your vocals very well, unfortunately, so I’m left to judge the music, and it’s intriguing. SONIC MACHINE GUN OVERLOAD! Okay, that’s more interesting, certainly. I don’t know if I call it music, but I certainly call it art.

Masterhyde
I didn’t like your entry last week, but now you’re back on my favorites list. At first, the repetition of the chorus bothered me, but I quickly warmed to it and never looked back. Simple concept, solid lyrics, and flawless execution. Do I like this? Check yes. Possible vote, and in the collection it goes.

(side note: if MC Eric B is going to buy his beats, he should buy them from you.)

DM6
I thought it was going to build into a big, rollickin’ powerhouse of a number…but the drummer never showed up. Having said that, I like this a lot. If you hooked up with a drummer and had someone else doing a laid-back blues vocal, this would be mighty powerful stuff indeed.

Hostess Mostess
Oh my god, Hostess is on vacation and f’ing GENESIS showed up to cover for him! I love every second of this, and the irony is, I don’t even like Genesis very much. Your vocal sounds incredible, the arrangement balances complexity and tenderness perfectly, and your melody is unique and insidious. Holy crap. What else can I say? Only this: Probable vote, and into the collection it goes.

Paco Del Stinko
I said it earlier, I’ll say it again: that riff is amazing. I wish your vocal was less Richard Cheese and more Frank Zappa; a lot more, actually. You’re a fantastic musician, and you need to team up with a fantastic vocalist to make masterful music. That’s not to say your voice is bad; on the contrary. It just can’t live up to the unstoppable duo of your guitar playing and arrangements.. Were it not for Hostess, this would be a possible vote; nevertheless, it goes right into my collection.

Flvxxvm Florvm (aka “the band name that must be cut and pasted into reviews”)
See, if you had done the vocal for DM6’s entry, it would have been fantastic. He didn’t have the vocal credibility to pull this off, and you do; musically, however, he’s got the upper hand. This isn’t bad, though. In fact, I like it. Can a song like this be called “cute”? Well, this one can, by me anyway. Everything but the lyrics, which (other than “I’ll be dead in the morning”) left me flat. Looking forward to your next entry.

Zipline
Good fills on the drumming, but bad timing; work on that. Get a pop filter for your microphone(s), and watch your levels, distortion-man. Okay, now that the production advice is out of the way…you missed an opportunity by delivering the chorus in such a narrow vocal range. That needed to go somewhere, and instead it went flat; I was disappointed. This feels like the first, improvised take of a song that (with a few weeks of development) could have been terrific.

Gawking Urethras
Like Hostess Mostess, you’re on vacation, only you’re being covered by Pearl Jam. Trouble is, they phoned it in; specifically, there’s no discernable melody being sung half of the time. You’ve got a good voice, but you need to be singing a well-crafted melody, not whatever randomly comes into your head…or at least sing in the same key as the instruments. Speaking of the instruments, they sound great.

(about seven hours after the above sentence was written) bolted from these reviews to take my wife to the hospital, just got back -- she’s fine, but the symptoms she was having made the doctor a bit nervous, so they kept her for the night. I won’t be finishing these reviews tonight, my apologies to the ignored folks, and I’ll be back in a few days. Please do not clutter this thread with "OMG is she okay" posts, lest the reviews be lost -- she's absolutely fine.

MintyHandy · Post by **MintyHandy** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 1:07 am

One more thing before I crash for the night:

The song conforms entirely to a specific, recognizable sub-genre;...(large, well-articulated and intelligent review of Gawking's entry redacted from this quote)

Boy, I would kill for that kind of insight on one of my songs, even if you hated it. Remind me to make a song that you feel qualified to examine, and then to pester you until you do the review to get me off your back.

wages · Post by **wages** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 10:42 am

SteveHandPuppet wrote: I'm not going to generalize for "Wages" music, but I can speak for my reaction to this particular song.

The song conforms entirely to a specific, recognizable sub-genre; the kind of ballad commerical "grunge" bands such as Stone Temple Pilots or Pearl Jam resorted to to soften or counterbalance their (already sweetened and watered-down) "hard" grunge. [Disclaimer: I was a dyed-in-the-flannel early grunge purist (minus the flannel), so the pop-oriented "grunge" of STP, AIC, Pearl Jam, etc. sounds horribly compromised compared the "real thing" (Mudhoney, TAD, the Fluid, GasHuffer etc.)]

....etc....etc...etc....

I had to drop the quote off...it seemed wrong to quote all 690 words of your detailed analysis (EDIT: Which IS appreciated). So what you are basically saying is, you pretty much don't like mainstream (or "pop") grunge. I've listened a lot to "the real thing", but I have difficulty getting into it for, what sounds like, the very reasons you don't like this tune. To me, the hardcore grunge bands such as Mudhoney (I saw them at Bumbershoot in Seattle BTW) don't put enough effort into the vocals, especially the melody. I guess I am looking more for a pop-like, Vedder-like melody. This is why I like the music of Metallica better than other metal bands such as Iron Maiden or Judas Priest. The other bands are "harder", but I just can't get into their "genre dedication".

The song conforms entirely to a specific, recognizable sub-genre

To get back on track, this is the answer I was seeking. I had no idea my songs were so blatantly STP, AIC, PJ, Nirvana, but it makes sense as the majority of songs I've learned were in this vein, indeed, these were THE bands that switched me from country to rock.

I think the new question is, does the SongFight community as a whole feel this way? (Feel that most of my entries are obviously grunge pop.) And if so, is this a distraction, a good thing, or a double-edged sword of both?

Finally, should this discussion be broken out into its own thread? I don't wanna cause clutter.

Post by jb » Sat Feb 03, 2007 11:02 am

I think if you like a genre, you like a genre. If you don't like genres, you'll tend to dislike things that obviously conform to a genre.

Your vocal performance lacks discipline, to me. Many notes are on key, and then I can sort of tell when you "lose yourself in the music" because all of a sudden you go way sharp. A producer would have you in the vocal booth all damn day getting rid of that sort of thing.

This song definitely isn't in a genre I like. I kind of despise the tough-guy-singing-sensitive-lyrics because I can't get behind the sentimental lyrics as presented by a gritty voice and tough guitars. That's just me. This reminds me of that song that's a hit about now, I guess, where some gritty-voiced dude is wailing away about how this girl has the "lips of an angel" and I just CRINGE to hear that voice singing those words.

Such a long history of this sort of thing, and it almost always turns me off, from Axl Rose to Staind. I don't like the vocals, but I also tend not to like the straightforward unsophisticated lyrics. It's like this big galoot trying to be romantic for the pretty girl. He gives it his best, but underneath it all he just doesn't know how.

I think I would like it more if you weren't yelling it. I can imagine myself getting behind a song from one of those bands, presented quietly, without the strained vocals. Like "Polly."

But Cobain never wrote lyrics so plain, did he? I don't really hear any Nirvana in your music, by the way. I don't really hear any Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, or Mudhoney for that matter. I hear the post-grunge pop bands. Staind. Fuel. Chris Doughtry. Hinder (the "lips of an angel" band). That sort of thing.

Video of Hinder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsjjKWVTXcw

God, they put strings under that song. Where's my icepick, I need to stick something in my ear.

JB

Märk · Post by **Märk** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:01 pm

jb wrote:Video of Hinder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsjjKWVTXcw

God, they put strings under that song. Where's my icepick, I need to stick something in my ear.

JB

TESTIFY, BROTHER! (I also hate this goddamned radio-staple-du-jour crap band)