Zen question

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wadewalbrun
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Zen question

Post by wadewalbrun »

When is an acoustic song just that, an acoustic song, and not considered a "demo". I see the term tossed around in reviews for seemingly all acoustic songs offered up. Is this simply a matter of personal taste, or is there some hurdle that typically distinguishes one acoustic song from another?
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Kevin Mellows
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Re: Zen question

Post by Kevin Mellows »

IMO if the artist is just recording a rough version of their song then it's a demo.

But if they spend the time to figure out the best mic placements, get the best takes, edit the tracks to clean them up, mix the song so it sounds good on a wide variety of speakers, and polish it with a little mastering, then surely it's more than just a demo.

A lot of acoustic songs here often don't sound like they have the level of polish you would expect for a commercial release. I'm not trying to make a judgement here, after all this is SongFight and not ProductionFight. But the difference between a demo and "more than a demo" is how much extra work you put into it.
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wadewalbrun
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Re: Zen question

Post by wadewalbrun »

Thanks Kevin. Good heavens, if "commercial release" quality is your hurdle in mind, then really, how many songs here, acoustic or otherwise, would be considered demos? Perhaps the "demo" label is not particularly useful as a descriptive element in the review process? Just a thought.
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Re: Zen question

Post by ken »

I agree, it is some mix of intention and polish.
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Kevin Mellows
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Re: Zen question

Post by Kevin Mellows »

wadewalbrun wrote:Thanks Kevin. Good heavens, if "commercial release" quality is your hurdle in mind, then really, how many songs here, acoustic or otherwise, would be considered demos? Perhaps the "demo" label is not particularly useful as a descriptive element in the review process? Just a thought.
Haha, personally, they all sound like demos to me, even my stuff. Honestly, I wouldn't know how to make a song sound good enough for what I would call a commercial release. But SF is such a good place to work on the chops, and I hope to get there one day.

I would agree calling someone's song here a "demo" is a bit pointless. It's also not that helpful. But I think people use that word to gently say, "I think this needs some work". Often times, just simply having a better mic and a little mixing can make a huge difference. It might not make something sound like a commercial release, but it will at least keep it from having that "recorded in a guy's basement" sound.
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Re: Zen question

Post by fluffy »

If there's a bunch of weird boom or hiss, and if the timing is sloppy, and if there's obvious mistakes or elements that show a lack of rehearsal or preparedness, it's probably a demo.

If there's lyrics which could be improved, or weird cadences in the delivery which haven't been fleshed out yet, or unfinished chord progressions that are very repetitive, it's probably a demo.

If it's posted to songfight.org it's probably a demo.
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Re: Zen question

Post by Caravan Ray »

fluffy wrote:If there's a bunch of weird boom or hiss, and if the timing is sloppy, and if there's obvious mistakes or elements that show a lack of rehearsal or preparedness, it's probably a demo.
.
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Re: Zen question

Post by Paco Del Stinko »

I toss around the term demo in reviews often. I also use the term 'scratchpad'. There's probably a difference between those terms as well, but when I use them, I mean to say that it sounds more like you're throwing an idea down to work on later. Commercial polish or not. Jotting ideas down, making notes almost, or rushing to get an outline down to kick around in the future. I suppose that in places demo means, or used to mean, a demonstration of what you intend to do. No?
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Re: Zen question

Post by josh »

I'd say the word demo is one of intention. As in, is the artist making a recording meant to demo an idea they later plan to elaborate on or polish or is the artist presenting it as a finished project. I think it'd be more sensible to say something doesn't sound well recorded or sounds sloppy rather than saying it sounds like a demo. I like to think about things that way. Especially after reading Frank Zappa's bio where he defined music as anything that's presented as music. And that it's not up to the listener to decide if something is music, but they have every right to like it or dislike it. It's a pretty logical way to look at it, since it makes the subjectivity vs. objectivity more clear.
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Re: Zen question

Post by jb »

The question of "demo or not" makes me think of three poorly-polished examples of "NOT DEMO":

1. The Mountaingoats early stuff
2. Guided by Voices
3. Iggy and the Stooges "Raw Power"

So I think it's really a question of intent, as Josh said.

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Re: Zen question

Post by Lunkhead »

I might call somebody's song a "demo" in a review on Song Fight! if I thought it sucked but I didn't want to be a complete dick about it, or if I thought it sucked but had potential. :P
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