Collab-o-rama!?

[wages]

Collab-o-rama. What is it? Why should I care? What the hell are you smoking? Can I have some?

I'll tell you soon. Because it's cool shit! You know! Hell no!

Okay. Collab-o-rama is a crazy idea I just had while typing on Jolly's Frenzy forum. Maybe it will be the greatest thing since AAD, or maybe it'll flop like so much The Red Chord coverfight, but here it is (without further ado)...

(pause for effect)

A <b>Collab-o-rama</b> is defined by Wages Dictionary as 1) a SongFight! sidefight in which two or more fighters pair off into collaborative groups for a set duration of time in either one-off fights or in the Nur Ein fight style or some variation <i>as determined at the beginning of a Collab-o-rama</i>; 2) a crazy idea that eats munky poo

My initial idea is to have 24 hours (or some other pre-determined time) for two or more collaborators to do a song together as a fight (of course, fight titles would be provided). This will test their might both at kamikaze songwriting, but also how well they can work as a team under such a short period of time. Beyond that, I would impose few if any imposing limits on your songwriting power (to semi-quote an Oysterhead tune).

Of course, this could be done in Nur Ein style or some elimiation variation (various rounds till we get a winner) if yall were down with that, but that would be very difficult to cordinate.

Thoughts? Ideas? Who would participate? Anyone wanna helm it, or would that be me?

[Justincombustion]

Question: Since I'm just a drummer, could I team up with GC to form as one perfect unit (like that night in that tattoo parlor in Chicago, right Glenn?) or am I on my own?
See, I'm not much of an actual "songwriter...."

[Reist]

See, I'm not much of an actual "songwriter...."

You should really get on that. I went to a John 'JR' Robinson clinic just a few weeks ago, and he stated clearly that every drummer should write and record music (take into account that he's possibly the most recorded studio drummer in history, and an excellent songwriter). If you don't even try to write music, you're missing out.

[wages]

Question: Since I'm just a drummer, could I team up with GC to form as one perfect unit (like that night in that tattoo parlor in Chicago, right Glenn?) or am I on my own?

Actually, that's EXACTLY what I'm talking about! You and someone form a "band" for the fight (preferably existing SongFight members, but whatever works). But of course, you will HAVE to pre-determine who you are working with, especially if they are writing the lyrics/music. But that's what this thread would be for.

[Reist]

I think it's a cool idea, but I'm not sure how well it would work in theory. Internet collabs rarely work out (at least for me), and this is in a pretty short time frame.

Don't let me burst your bubble. I'd like to see this idea develop a bit before I jump on the train.

[Billy's Little Trip]

You lost me at the 24 hour thing. I'm boycotting any fight that gives me less than a week to complete a song. In fact, every time I do a collab, it even takes longer.
I'm trying to focus on making better music, (which I know is subjective) not make more music.
By the way, this is just my opinion because I don't have the time that some of you do to work on music. But I like listening to your fast and furious productions. Good luck with this.

[spinlock]

I like the idea... ish.

1) I'm at the stage in my music where quantity and quality aren't exclusive. The more I make, the better I will get.
2) Collaborations can be fun, but they are tricky in a technical sense, and certainly take more time.

So, following that logic,
3) Practicing collaborating should improve the speed and quality with which I can collaborate.

Big problem for me are
a) time zones - it's tough to collaborate with someone in america, the frenzies happen at 2am my time, so leave me knackered.
b) technology - I've had some success at using skype to play music to people, but it's hopeless as a jamming tool. Exporting single tracks isn't easy in the program I'm used to using (garageband)

So in conclusion, this sounds like a great idea. I'd love to get involved in more collabs, and I don't have a job right now, so I have loads of time.
There are just some technical obstacles to work out.
I think
* having a week for it would be good
* having randomly-selected, or rotating partners would be useful, on the basis that it's about honing our collaborating skills
* most people don't have enough spare time to do this.

I do, LoO probably does, I don't know about anyone else.

[spinlock]

Okay, I thought a bit more about it, and have a suggestion with more details.

Here's my suggestion for a Collab-o-rama which is designed to encourage people's collab skills, make cool music, new friends and so on.

It takes place over five weeks, with 6 participants, A to F.

Title each week.

They are paired off each week as so:

1 - AB, CD, EF
2 - AD, CF, BE
3 - AF, CE, BD
4 - AC, DE, BF
5 - AE, DF, BC

Points are 5 for 1st place 3 for 2nd place, and 1 for 3rd place. The places can be got by forum vote, or panel or whatever. This prevents a brilliant collab one week overshadowing a bunch of very badly collab'd entries in another week.

If someone is unable to collab one week due to unforseen circumstances, you allow their partner to either enter on their own, or, preferably, join another group. In either case, for that week, the disappeared party earns no points/votes.

I would also suggest that at the start people publish a short profile saying what their skills are, how they like to collaborate, what sort of tools they have available and so on. For example, mine would say:

Spinlock

Songwriting:
Good at generic tune production and harmonizing. Not great at lyrics.
Currently interested in creating interesting and varied arrangements.
Styles: Varied, but at home in pop, or pop-anything (pop-rock etc)

Performance:
Strong at Keyboards, vocals.
Not bad at guitars, trumpets.

Recording:
Some experience at effects and mixing
Not great at mastering.

Personal bests:
Bloodwork (limbofight 1), Get a Life

Technical and organisation
Times available: 10am to 6 pm GMT May be busy at weekends.
Tools: Garageband, audacity. Can provide individual track mp3s/oggs/wavs, but prefers .band or .aup where possible. Has own hosting.
Communication (in order of preference): Skype, msn, forum, email. Use the forum PM to swap details.

[j$]

Spinlock
Times available: 10am to 6 pm GMT May be busy at weekends.

Do you work nights?

[spinlock]

Don't have a job. But I'm looking for something that lets me be free a couple of days a week in the day, or is weekend only.

[wages]

BLT and Spinlock... great points. You are right, SideFights (especially ones as complicated as a Collab-o-rama) should be about honing, improving, and learning to work with others rather than kamikaze style songwriting.

BLT is totally right about the 24 hour aspect of it. It's a real stinker. Obviously a time frame needs to be determined that will actually work. What about a week? So maybe 1 week to write/record/mix/submit, 1 to 2 weeks for reviews/judging, then round two begins. But like you said, to collab a good fight, we might need longer than 1 week...especially if it is the random collabing as suggested by Spinlock.

Spinlock brings up great points about Time Zones and Technology (no need to rehash... just go read what he wrote above; I 100% agree). These are definitely hurdles that must be dealt with. Of course, if the fight is carefully planned ahead and scheduled, we should be able to overcome these two obstacles.

Spinlock ideas...
1) Quantity vs Quality... me too. I think quantity <i>can</i> lead to quality, but not always. Ultimately, we should be concerned with quality. Very good argument for a longer-than-24-hours fight... though a Collab-o-rama skirmish wouldn't be out of the question... In fact, a skirmish might be the best way do a trial Collab-o-rama. Hmmm... wheels turning....

2) Collabs can be fun and tricky..... Very true, which is, I think, the same/similar point BLT was making. Another BIG piece of support for a longer duration and careful planning.

3) Yeah!

I especially like it when you said "to encourage people's collab skills". That should be the primary focus of this SideFight.

Duration... 5 weeks for 5 collab songs might be too difficult. If it were something like 10 weeks for 5 rounds (1 week of fighting/1 of reviews and taking a break) or some other similar breakdown, it would be more accessible to fighters who have lives (not me!).

Points...I like your scoring method. Anyone agree/disagree?

If someone is unable to collab one week due to unforeseen circumstances, you allow their partner to either enter on their own, or, preferably, join another group. In either case, for that week, the disappeared party earns no points/votes.

This is probably going to be one of the biggest issues. Someone(s) could volunteer to be an "alternate" in the event one of the collab fighters can't participate. In fact, if we decide it is likely that every round with need an alternate, I could refrain from the main fight and solely be the alternate. Of course, my skills being only songwriting/singing/rhythm guitar, that might be limiting depending on the collabing partner. Thoughts?

Voting.... I think a forum vote would be the easiest method, but I'm impartial to the voting method.

Short profile... great idea. We might make up a preliminary questionnaire designed to obtain the most useful information for your collabing partners. Before the fight starts, everyone gets a period of time to fill out the Short Profile and therefore commit to the Collab-o-rama. Then a couple of days are taken to pair everyone off for the round and let them determine how they will work together (who's writing what and how you will exchange files). Once everyone is ready, we set a due date and GO!

Thoughts? Complaints? Kudos?

[Nigel (spOOn) Clements]

hmmm! I keep reading these post's and I'm really interested in the way it's going, I had a similar idea few month's ago with regards to creating a league table comprised from ongoing sidefight's which the collab-o-rama idea would fit nicely coupled with the scoring system suggested, yeah location, time differences, commitments etc.. all play a factor, but most of us, do find time on a regular basis so something could always be sorted, as far as exchanging file types, the wav seems to be the tried and tested, and can therefore be imported into most if not all packages.

I'd certainly be interested, though feel a commencement date would hve to be cast in stone, so that any sidefights that get thrown up in between the "yeah it's gonna happen" stage and the "oh my god it starts tomorrow" stage, can be avoided by those that have made a commitment to participate.

[rone rivendale]

Actually with my lyrical writing skills, I could pair up with anyone who has musical skills and come up with a frickin hit.

[spinlock]

Ok. How about a spinrone or ronelock entry for this week's fight?
Write me some lyrics and I'll write you the music.

[spinlock]

Wages:
I like your flexibility-based approach. Would that leave open the possibility that we could do 5 collabs in 5 weeks, if it turned out that everyone's schedule fit it? I like the idea of the slightly longer pre-fight period each week. Would it be set up so that we could say 'hang on, this weekend I have a funeral, can the deadline be wednesday instead'?
Also like the alternate idea. Much better than mine, and makes it easier for people to drop out of a week without feeling too bad about it.
I'm wondering if 10 days might be a good time frame. 3 days for getting to know your new partner and voting on the old fight, organising who does what etc, and 7 days from when the title is posted.

[Rinkydink]

i had an idea about the points/votes which would help sort out the 'i can't do it this week' scenario:

the points awarded for each enty is an even number and split evenly between the 2 collaborators for each fight no matter who did what e.g.

fight 1

a&b scored 10
c&d scored 8
e&f scored 6
g&h scored 4
i&j scored 0
k&l scored 2

so collaborator a and collaborator b get 5 points each, c and d get 4 points each etc.

so there is a league table of 'who is the best collaborator'

any week when one of the collaborators can't participate their partner automatically gets half the points they would have got if they won, so in this example they would get 2.5 points

this means that you get points if you can't collab because yer partner for that week can't or can't be arsed, it also means that if you are the collaborator who can't be arsed to take part that week you are giving one of the others automatic points without earning any yourself so there is an incentive to take part each round of collaborations............does this make sense?

[rone rivendale]

Ok. How about a spinrone or ronelock entry for this week's fight?
Write me some lyrics and I'll write you the music.

Actually you'd need to give me the music first. That's how I've always done my songs. I do the music and then figure out how to work the lyrics in there.

But yeah, I'd like to collab with ya dude. Let's win this. Just send the music to my email or upload it to lightningmp3.com and give me the link. Whatever works for you.