The Song Fight Bulletin Board

-Manhattan Glutton-
and by the way ... wow, wow, wow... thanks

[/quote]
sexy huh? Why thank you. If you could see me right now you'd laugh that you said that. I was going for a b-52s thing. Didn't quite come out that way. The guitar and drums were recorded as one, in the tiniest, most echoey, and ill equipped jam room ever. We then sat down and wrote lyrics... To make sure the vocals sounded appropriately f'ed up we recorded them through an amp and into the same mic, in the same room. It came out better than expected, thus entered...

P.s. You give awesome reviews... and I kind of like it when people are mean, and critical.[/quote]

That makes me feel better. Now I am just obsessing about over posting. It's like I came out of nowhere, and then just went FLARGGGHGHG.
I can see that... the B-52s thing. I learn something every day around here

You keep talking about sprucing up your song, but part of what makes it so powerful is the sparseness. It's not really a pop hit and shouldn't be over-produced like one, but that's just like, my opinion, man.

Manhattan Glutton wrote:You keep talking about sprucing up your song, but part of what makes it so powerful is the sparseness. It's not really a pop hit and shouldn't be over-produced like one, but that's just like, my opinion, man.

hmmm. interesting.
i am kinda wondering about that clip though. is there a way to trick that without touching the rest?

RangerDenni wrote:i am kinda wondering about that clip though. is there a way to trick that without touching the rest?

I can imagine a way to significantly reduce the artifacts, but to my knowledge it hasn't been implemented by anyone so far. You can also manually edit the wave form... and you can probably reproduce the take in the same time.

Manhatten Glutton wrote:
lala - Are you drumming on your guitar? Because that is legit. This is a good entry. I'm not sure why there is sex and shame in a vest factory. The only improvement would be extra production.

Um, I think I'm drumming on it? Or hammering on it? Or something? I have basically no formal guitar training so I fake my way through everything. Sometimes it works, sometimes not so much. Thanks for calling it legit Oh, and "sex and shame in the vest factory" = shameful filler. Lots of times I make my lyrics fit the tune in my head.

And DJ Ranger Den: Thanks for calling the vocals BYUMMM-y (or whatever that was?) and sophisticated sounding. SWEET And while I find it hilarious that you "lurk" please keep writing reviews. They are super entertaining!

Manhattan Glutton wrote: Fitz - Not bad for a live recording, but it's just so generic. Singer needs help staying on key.

Yeah, yeah, and yeah. I was seriously surprised with how not horrific it sounded, but it was just three chords played in a standard way, with absolutely nothing to make it stand out. And I don't know if it is the time of year, or what, but my voice has been sounding like crap for weeks. I just about blew it out today failing at recording. It's making me madder than I can explain. This was more along the lines of a review I expected for this song, or one I would give this song. Thanks!

Un-processed reviews, Gimme a holler if you want or need clarification.

Cabbage Stare - Cold intro. I get the intention, but might've liked a slow throb better. I like the sireny sound, but don't understand the ricochets. Dangerous, I guess. I dunno. Sounds slapped together without a lot of thought.

The Chadderandom Abyss - Very Captain Beefheart, but lazy and less exciting sounding. I heard that Trout Mask was very much rehearsed. Regardless, this has more of a flow than some of your other entries. And kind of a melody. This would be a good one to cover, and turn into a pop song. Hmm. Must take notes.

Darkroom - I like the groove and slurry synth lines. Warm vibe, overall. Could use some more word flow or whatever the kids call it these days. Good little jamming bridge, could be a bit more in your face, I think. Chorus is almost catchy, or is while the song plays but doesn't stick around long afterwards. Good tune, turn up the menace a tad.

Die Toten Schlaghosen - Good one to run underneath a video. Kind of get the point by the halfway mark. Sounds good, and the drill sergeant or slave-driver is a good touch.

DJ Ranger Den - Very intimate. The piano is moody and honest, rain down a window glass. I'd like to hear the voice step up front more, I'm struggling to understand the lyrics. I like the wash of the gongs or tam-tams. Very nice. We all have our own styles, and I'd love to hear you change directions next week. Anyway, very personal sound here, a meditation or stream of consciousness type thing.

Fitzroy - This song is simple and scruffy I smile each time I hear it, shard being a key word here. The lyrics sound either improvised or non-edited, ala MOI. Sorry, not meant as an insult! I really like this and hear much underdeveloped ideas within. Live feel is great and Circle Jerks guitar solo drives it home. Miss the bass, but hey!

James Owens - One of my faves this week. Here's something I've never said, probably never thought: I'd love to hear me sing this. I like your voice plenty but can't help but hear my voice here. Just don't lose the awesome flute solo, a total delight. I dig the groove here, the chorus works even though backing vocals would be sweet. Love the arrangement, balance, instrumentation. Don't know if it's the best song, but might be my fave.

Johnny Cashpoint - The metal drums remind me of some video game. Lyrics are excellent, nice and sulfuric. The delivery is bit crowded, but so what. This is more weed than wine, which suits me fine nowadays. A rocked out version might work, but I like the werbly version here. A bit rushed, perhaps, but the point driven home makes it strong.

lalabrookie - This could easily be done with a phaser guitar and Zeppelin drums. Complete with Plant howls. However, this is a good tune for offering factory worker tension. Ever been there? Sucks. Simple but strong melody. Funny how the major/minor changes come and go so quickly, you nail them. Pop filter alert! Harmony vocals are very welcome and well done.

Paco del Stinko - I can't deny that I don't enjoy the "don't get the sleeves" line. I hate the vocal effect, too much delay. And something's wrong with the vocal delivery, esp. on the chorus. I like the lead guitar tone though. Drunken fretless bass. Hey, lyrics one day, all the music another. Eh.

The Panna Cotta Army - Should be the winner. First listen, I couldn't stand the wait for the "...at the vest factory" lines to arrive. Felt like an eternity. But many listens later, I totally dig the flow. Niely balanced arrangement wise, as well as instrumentally and mix, this song is very strong. I think I need to hear harmony vocals, but it might be pre-conditioning. Strong tune that improves with each listen.

Schlimminy Cricket - Almost sounds like a joke tune at its start. You're very talented but please don't take yourself too seriously. Nice vocal work, the lower notes a big plus. Nice pace, steady flow, once it catches itself. Mix-wise, the Glock might sound better back in the mix, dosed with some reverb. Regardless, it's the tune that matters and this is a good one.

Paco Del Stinko wrote:I'd love to hear me sing this.

I completely see what you mean! -- but just for the doggerel. The snarky verses need replacing altogether.

Glad you liked the flute solo, that's my favourite bit.

As for the backing band, I now think it needs more colour and variety in the tone -- it's kind of a grey wash. Manhattan Glutton's remark about bringing up the 3kHz range helped me see this.

Mr. Owens: please don't interpret my vocal comments as a slight against your voice or performnce. It struck me, startlingly so, that I could hear my voice in there. No big fan of my voice, just heard it as a good fit.

Paco Del Stinko wrote:Mr. Owens: please don't interpret my vocal comments as a slight against your voice or performnce. It struck me, startlingly so, that I could hear my voice in there. No big fan of my voice, just heard it as a good fit.

No misunderstanding there. For these lyrics, your voice would be just right. And you can call me Jim!

Yes... I dunno if you can really hear it, but at the very beginning you can hear my drummer laughing and saying "pushed out a shard"... Basically these lyrics were a joke... A horrible inside joke that was really only funny to the two pot heads making them. The words were written down, but I improvised a few little things... And there will be bass in the future, as I just worked some lovin magic on my sisters old bass, and got it functional... Which is nice.

W.A.I.L. I.A.A.C.

cabbage stare - Sounds like being in a club on K dancing to music through a faulty PA. Which is awesome, naturally. The experimentation appeals. Wish the musical riff ebbing and flowing out of the mix was a bit stronger melodically but I'm a pop bitch.

Chanderandom Abyss - I love the tone to the guitar. very new wave spikey riff. The bass end needs to be fatter to sit off the guitar. Also it's a little rigid. Not bad. Not a van of the vocal delivery - too uptight in the wrong way.

Dark Room - tee hee you're called Dark Room. This sounds like the 80s filtered through Grand Theft Auto. I am not a fan of the rap particularly - though it's a good stylistic choice for the backing track. Some good lines, some particularly bad ones. I would suggest if you're going to back up the melody in the chorus by playing it on the keyboard, the tone should be stronger, a bit more grind to it. It seems a bit pointless as it is. the tone, I mean.

Die Toten Shlagenhosen - i was hoping for a bit more Shlager to be honest - the drums are too 4 /4 - there should be more of a swing to it. A nice tango beat would suit this better. Awesome use of vocoders - I love Bruce Haack so this wins over and the diea of Bruce Haack playing shlager is pure genius. This doesn't get there, but it's a good song that doesn't outstay its welcome.

DJ Ranger Den - pretty piano-ing. This sounds like Courtney Love doing Tori Amos to me. I don't think the melody is anywhere near strong enough to support the song, to be honest. it's very well performed and there's some interesting "studio tricvkery" which appeals very much to me, but I think it drags when it should fly. or rather it starts soaring around 2 minutes then drops out again. A frustrating listen for me, then, cos I want more of the stuff that's less present, and less of that which is more.

UNKNOWN - I like the live recording (though next time - vocals are too loud. They're not bad at all but they're smearing all over the tune.) Nice little solo-ing. Lyrics are meh for me. That ends abruptly!

James Owens - Nice. Loving the organ and the tape saturation feel to the arrangement. Maybe the guitar's a tad loud, but eh. I like the vocal performance here. it feels a little ... artifical (i.e. not organic) but it's very well done. Prog-pop is fine. Good flutey solo. Reminds me weirdly of The Trogg's ocarina rather than The Tull. This feels a little long. Some good lines - though how you would go about making a sow's ear look like a silk purse is beyond me. Oh there's something of the Psychedelic Furs here.

Johnny Cashpoint - me. I had a ten minute drone dub song for you but panicked at the last and wrote and recorded this half an hour. I agree with Paco the arrangement is a bit crowded. I like the solo very much. I was interested in the collision between pop and noise. That's all. Oh no, one more thing - having moaned about loud vocals, I realise listening back my vocals are mixed WAY too loud.

Brooke Tournoux - this sounds lovely. The vocal / vocal performance is a bit earnest for my tastes. "love and hate, sex and shame in the vest factory" is possibly the most ridiculous chorus line I have heard in the time. This feels done at 2.30ish (despite the cool contrapuntal bvs around then). I like the boxy percussion.

Paco Del Stinko - super bonkers as usual! "You don't get the sleeves, but you do get the rest" Maybe not as catchy as some previous masterverks from your good self, but there are some interesting chord shifts and there is a theatricality here that suggest you and James Owens are born to collab.

Panna Cotta Army - I like the driving nature the drums give it. Great little keys plinking away in there. Melody is really really nice but TOTALLY let down by the appalling lyric. Seriously, these words are rubbish. Why would you take someone to a factory you've just been laid off from? How is that a journey of discovery? I could go on - you do I'm sorry if you were pleased with them, it sounds to me that you're making them up as you go along, and that's just not good enough. I would have voted for this otherwise.

Schlimminy Cricket - Good chunky ukulele playing - is that two uke players playing the same chords slightly out of sync, or are you going for the flangey effect? Either way it works here. Like the glock. This is a minute half song going on for two and a half and the uke becomes a bit relentless, but other than that, good effort.

I'm going to vote for Die Toten Schlaghosen for sure, maybe one or two others.

In case no one noticed, I like responding

j$ wrote: UNKNOWN - I like the live recording (though next time - vocals are too loud. They're not bad at all but they're smearing all over the tune.) Nice little solo-ing. Lyrics are meh for me. That ends abruptly!
.

I assume this was me, cause we were the only blatantly live recording. We totally miffed the ending, it went on for an awkward 10 seconds of ear abuse. I cut it at a spot where it sounded like we could have ended there... I guess. And you are especially lucky we went with my lame excuse (my words) for lead guitar rather than the hand clap solo we also recorded. Thanks for the review.

Paco Del Stinko wrote:
lalabrookie - This could easily be done with a phaser guitar and Zeppelin drums. Complete with Plant howls. However, this is a good tune for offering factory worker tension. Ever been there? Sucks. Simple but strong melody. Funny how the major/minor changes come and go so quickly, you nail them. Pop filter alert! Harmony vocals are very welcome and well done.

Thanks, Paco...all day I've been thinking about Zeppelin covering this song...and I think you're right. Could have totally worked out!I May have to take all the songs that are awkward yet relentless in my head and think about how LZ would have done it. Could help me modify the style to make it work. And excuse the newb - but what is a pop filter? And yes, been there, done that (factory life) and it definitely sucked, but I will say I liked all of those people much better than most of my nice "civilized" office co-workers who would stab me in the back in a heartbeat if it meant a chance for a promotion!Bastages...

A pop filter is a cloth covered apparatus that attaches to your microphone stand to prevent plosie or popping sounds made by the letter P and other culprits. They can be store bought or home made, the latter method having been discussed on the boards here somewhere. Here's a link to better explain.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pop_filter

j$ wrote:W
DJ Ranger Den - pretty piano-ing. This sounds like Courtney Love doing Tori Amos to me. I don't think the melody is anywhere near strong enough to support the song, to be honest. it's very well performed and there's some interesting "studio tricvkery" which appeals very much to me, but I think it drags when it should fly. or rather it starts soaring around 2 minutes then drops out again. A frustrating listen for me, then, cos I want more of the stuff that's less present, and less of that which is more.

I think you're right about what you say. This has been a frustrating month for me musically. This was kind of an experiment. You kind of caught me out. The part was really pieced together, last second, and the vocals were an improv. The lyrics are personal reflections shoved through a needle of three metaphors with a vest slapped on. But it's funny, because I always wear vests; so they fit me. The whole thing fits. This review fits. Your summation of the vocals fits. I think if I think about it I can probably add it to the others, and think, and do something with it. maybe on this, and hopefully next week.

(too many smileys.)

j$ wrote:TOTALLY let down by the appalling lyric. Seriously, these words are rubbish. Why would you take someone to a factory you've just been laid off from? How is that a journey of discovery? I could go on - you do I'm sorry if you were pleased with them, it sounds to me that you're making them up as you go along, and that's just not good enough. I would have voted for this otherwise.

J$ - I'm sorry the lyrics caused you so much offense. If it's any consolation, I totally agree with you - they are dumb and inane. I didn't have much time to write the lyrics - and they were partly made up as I was recording the vocal.
TBH, I thought that the title was pretty ridiculous in the first place, so it didn't really matter if they weren't that meaningful. At the same time I didn't think the music/melody really leant itself to comic lyrics - i.e. what other people (notably you and James Owens) have done rather successfully.
So I went for the meaningless pop lyric (the sort no one pays attention to anyway); something that just fits to the scan of the melody. Obviously a mistake which has been exposed by you and Spintown. I'll try not to make it again, but I can't promise as I'm not blessed in the lyric-writing department.

No, not offence, just frustration, because it's a great song deserving a better lyric. IMO, obviously. what do I know?

For: The Panna Cotta Army
From: an unprofessional listener who might not be right

Liked:
Sounds like a convincing and technically well finished song to me. Nice voice.

What I would have done differently:
The song still left me with a missing, or unfinished break-out feeling. It felt to me like the verses had more power in than the chorus. I would expect chorus to be like a conclusion to the whole song, that reliefs the tension that gets cumulated during the verse. Try to imagine your song as a balloon you fill with air during the verse, and when it comes the right time you pick the needle and boom comes the explosion! That "I can take you there" in your case(I think) worked like letting the air out slowly through your fingers... fffsssssss.

Thank's for your music. Was great listening to it. Made me smile with the "blame it on the economy" thing.

For: J$
From: an unprofessional listener who might not be right

Liked:
Nicely worked voice and sounds. Interesting approach to the subject. While listening I imagined this song as the possible Shrek 6 soundtrack main hit when the hero goes to the kingdom's factory . Really liked the second chorus. You could really catch and express that childish fooling around feeling.

What I would have done differently:
That first chorus is hardly a chorus for me, just another verse sang to times a little differently. Would have used the second chorus more in the song. I had the feeling that the solo was kind of slowing down and held back the song instead of helping on building it up.

Thank's for your music. You gave me that childish Shrek feeling of let's shake up things.

Reviews exhaust me -and I'll have a bevy to write this week- so let me condense by saying that I voted for the two chicks. Excellent stuff. Ridiculous production choices. Stream-of-consciousness lyrics. Yet they both created an atmosphere - a vibe, if you will. Cheers.