The Song Fight Bulletin Board

The Weakest Suit wrote:i would really like to see data on if the judges consistantly score acts they are familiar with higher than acts they have not been exposed to as frequently. familiarity adds instant likeability to a lot of things.

I think that it's more likely that enjoying someone's work causes a listener to become more familiar with someone's work.

erik wrote:

The Weakest Suit wrote:i would really like to see data on if the judges consistantly score acts they are familiar with higher than acts they have not been exposed to as frequently. familiarity adds instant likeability to a lot of things.

I think that it's more likely that enjoying someone's work causes a listener to become more familiar with someone's work.

probably true, but that's a different point. if i like someone's work i'll definitely look for more of it to listen to. the point i was trying to make though, is that if i'm given a bunch of songs to listen to, and some of those songs are from people who i am already a fan of, the familiarity of hearing that artists voice or "sound" will endear me to the song more than hearing an artist for the first time, great song or not. example: if you buy a comp cd with a couple artists you like on it and a bunch you don't know, at first, how often do you listen through the whole cd without skipping to the artists you like?

The Weakest Suit wrote: looks like it was a 4 or 5 horse race the last few years. i would really like to see data on if the judges consistantly score acts they are familiar with higher than acts they have not been exposed to as frequently. familiarity adds instant likeability to a lot of things. i was hoping that the nur ein judges would be people who had no previous knowledge of any of the participants, but i conceed that that might be a tricky feet to pull off.

That's an interesting question. How does familiarity affect the Nur Ein? The original Nur Ein had Johnny Cashpoint, Me, Mogosagatai and Jack Shite as the judges. Was familiarity an issue with that jury...not really. We knew Leaf but weren't that knowledgable of his solo work. The other 3 members of the jury were pretty new to the Calfborg stuff and I think we were all new to Ross Durand. Those are three prime examples of us being unaffected by the familiarity issue. They fared just as well as bands we were more familiar with.

Nur Ein II had me, bzl, mo, Glenn & Ken on the jury. This one is a slightly different story. The bands that were newest to us were BLT & Reist (formerly Jolly Roger). Both fared well. Now it's no secret that Glenn is a big Puce fan and used to be in Grammar Club with him. I'm a big Abom fan. Glenn's quite the Frankie fan. And Ken+Merisan= Tiny Robots. So there was some familiarity there. But I can tell you that when it came down to the voting, the familiarity didn't factor in.

This year's jury has me, sp00n, Merisan, Adam (formerly Puce) and Rabid Garfunkel. It's a very very diverse group, so I see familiarity being even less of an issue.

Niveous wrote:

The Weakest Suit wrote: looks like it was a 4 or 5 horse race the last few years. i would really like to see data on if the judges consistantly score acts they are familiar with higher than acts they have not been exposed to as frequently. familiarity adds instant likeability to a lot of things. i was hoping that the nur ein judges would be people who had no previous knowledge of any of the participants, but i conceed that that might be a tricky feet to pull off.

That's an interesting question. How does familiarity affect the Nur Ein? The original Nur Ein had Johnny Cashpoint, Me, Mogosagatai and Jack Shite as the judges. Was familiarity an issue with that jury...not really. We knew Leaf but weren't that knowledgable of his solo work. The other 3 members of the jury were pretty new to the Calfborg stuff and I think we were all new to Ross Durand. Those are three prime examples of us being unaffected by the familiarity issue. They fared just as well as bands we were more familiar with.

Nur Ein II had me, bzl, mo, Glenn & Ken on the jury. This one is a slightly different story. The bands that were newest to us were BLT & Reist (formerly Jolly Roger). Both fared well. Now it's no secret that Glenn is a big Puce fan and used to be in Grammar Club with him. I'm a big Abom fan. Glenn's quite the Frankie fan. And Ken+Merisan= Tiny Robots. So there was some familiarity there. But I can tell you that when it came down to the voting, the familiarity didn't factor it.

This year's jury has me, sp00n, Merisan, Adam (formerly Puce) and Rabid Garfunkel. It's a very very diverse group, so I see familiarity being even less of an issue.

thanks for the info. that is indeed a diverse group of judges. puce, fbf, merisan, and abom were among my favorites last year, so i'm not disagreeing with the judging last year, i was just curious. thanks again.

The Weakest Suit wrote:

erik wrote:I think that it's more likely that enjoying someone's work causes a listener to become more familiar with someone's work.

probably true, but that's a different point. if i like someone's work i'll definitely look for more of it to listen to. the point i was trying to make though, is that if i'm given a bunch of songs to listen to, and some of those songs are from people who i am already a fan of, the familiarity of hearing that artists voice or "sound" will endear me to the song more than hearing an artist for the first time, great song or not. example: if you buy a comp cd with a couple artists you like on it and a bunch you don't know, at first, how often do you listen through the whole cd without skipping to the artists you like?

Well, it's a different point because I was disagreeing with you. I don't think that merely being familiar with how an artist sounds is going to make you more likely to like a new song of theirs. There are a handful of SF artists whose music I am intimately familiar with, but that familiarity doesn't make me like their stuff.

To your example: Back when I bought comps, I would often play tracks first from bands I already knew. But I didn't like the songs any more because I already knew the bands who made them: sometimes I liked the songs and sometimes I didn't.

The judges have to listen to all the song so nobody should worry about getting the short end that way in Nur Ein, unlike with casual listening to compilations or whatever. Also, I think a judge may just as easily be harder on someone he/she is familiar with, because familiarity can create expectations. Personally, I'm probably a bit more excited by good songs from people I've not heard much from before than "merely" good songs from people that I think can be really great. Bryan Kandel from last year is a good example of somebody new that I liked a lot. I would have liked to see him make it past Round 2.

I've spoken to my band mates and the Worldly Self Assurance would like to officially enter Nur Ein III.

On the knowing the judges bit, I feel Ken whom I know really well was particularly hard on me in the "No One Else" fight. It was fair, but there wasn't anything close to favoritism in the judging, perhaps the opposite.

My hope for this year is that no one drops out due to deadlines, it was a bummer to see the Be Wells and BL/BR fall out for such last year.

When do we begin?

EDIT- ah yes, I should read the whole post, there at the bottom I see it. Sorry.

glennny wrote:When do we begin?

http://songfight.net/forums/viewtopic.p ... 89#p113089

erik wrote:Well, it's a different point because I was disagreeing with you.

i never thought for one second you'd actually be agreeing with me on anything.
feel free to disagree with this.

The Weakest Suit wrote:

erik wrote:Well, it's a different point because I was disagreeing with you.

i never thought for one second you'd actually be agreeing with me on anything.
feel free to disagree with this.

I don't know what I said to give you this impression of me. Sorry you feel that way.

The Weakest Suit wrote:[i would really like to see data on if the judges consistantly score acts they are familiar with higher than acts they have not been exposed to as frequently. familiarity adds instant likeability to a lot of things. i was hoping that the nur ein judges would be people who had no previous knowledge of any of the participants, but i conceed that that might be a tricky feet to pull off.

Hey now, you keep your hands off my feet

I promise to listen to and judge the songs, period. I think I'm schitzy enough to leave the artist out of the reckoning and live up to that promise, heh.

SO I know that this is a nitpicky question, but those familiar with my history with Nur Ein! know that I'm sort of a rules guy.

In Nur Ein! 1 titles were announced on the same day every week, so let's say it was Monday - that was day one - the next monday was day 8 - results announced, but also the new day one - new title.

I think last year it went Monday - then around to Tuesday, then Wednesday, etc.....

Which way is this planned to be?

Curious only, mostly.

I would like to be in, but I'm not sure I will be able to write/record during the final rounds. (I'll be in Europe starting June 22 or so.) Which would be lame.

Niv, can you project an end date, assuming we start on April 27?

Projected Dates are as follows:

Round Zero:
Sunday April 27th to Monday May 5th

Round One:
Monday May 5th to Tuesday May 13th

Round Two:
Tuesday May 13th to Wednesday May 21st

Round Three:
Wednesday May 21st to Thursday May 29th

Round Four:
Thursday May 29th to Friday June 6th

Round Five:
Friday June 6th to Saturday June 14th

Round Six:
Saturday June 14th to Sunday June 22nd

Final Round:
Sunday June 22nd to Monday June 30th

Am I too late? I WANTS INS!

EDIT: I posted that in a hurry without reading the thread, after Glenny tipped me off that it was NUR ON.

So yeah, count me in for Round Zero. As "Chemical Shitstorm".


Yes. Chemical Shitstorm.



You heard me.



What?

Also, about this from earlier in the thread:

Last year I got really bored at work and made this:

http://people.geneticmail.com/sam/nur_ein_table.html

Can you please place me at the top of your 2008 grid if I make the round zero cut? It appears that whomever you place at the top ends up winning.

I kill me

Okay, well I'm going to do it anyway and assume I may be out by the time I'm leaving for my trip OR I may have to put together a MOBILE ROCK UNIT.

So yes, I am in.

ERIK! Are you really in? Because if you are, others may follow. But if you are not, they may not.

FRANK! I am in. I haven't recorded anything in forever, so it may sound like ass, but I'ma try anyways.

I'll enter for Round Zero and see what happens.

Niveous wrote:Projected Dates are as follows:

Round Zero:
Sunday April 27th to Monday May 5th

Round One:
Monday May 5th to Tuesday May 13th

Round Two:
Tuesday May 13th to Wednesday May 21st

Round Three:
Wednesday May 21st to Thursday May 29th

Round Four:
Thursday May 29th to Friday June 6th

Round Five:
Friday June 6th to Saturday June 14th

Round Six:
Saturday June 14th to Sunday June 22nd

Final Round:
Sunday June 22nd to Monday June 30th

So...as long as I do an awesome song in round 3 to get me immunity for the next round when Caravan Ray leaves he country and takes his recording stuff with him, and assuming I can track him down again in New Zealand before Round 5 - I should be right! Piece of piss.

erik wrote:FRANK! I am in. I haven't recorded anything in forever, so it may sound like ass, but I'ma try anyways.

I was feeling the same way, so I entered this week and I'm trying for next week. I need to get reacquainted with my shiz.
I'm really looking forward to hearing you two.

I'm thinking Nur Ein should be the way to break out my new name - Reïst in Peace. Or is that too lame?