The Song Fight Bulletin Board

RangerDenni wrote:Frankie..
I very muchly do admire your work so hearing nice things said about what I am doing is certainly a day-maker, to say the least

Awww.....credit where credit is due, m'lady.

Holy shit you guys are so serious on here! i never take critique well.. but fuck you guys dish it out... thanks for the non "hook" comments and the ok song comments... ive wanted to do a project like this for 10 years now.. so im just having fun with it with my fellow band mate terry... i tend to agree on the "hook" part of our track... but I enjoy it none the less.. sometimes its ok to just have a droning track you can drive to and not even have to think about so i like it non the less.. great tracks this week. im glad to lose. Im thankful for this site.. fun to just have to get tracks out.. and have fun doing it!

Rocky..
Well.. this place is called song FIGHT. so you are probably not going to find a place filled with nothing but heart and lollipop-laden reviews.
A good way to become inured to them is to do some right-on-point, straight-to-the-bone critique yourself. I have a hard time doing that because it doesn't seem polite; and find myself agoninzing over hurting the feelings of folks who seem to have no qualms over completely deconstructing my work! I feel they are most likely doing me the better service and I probably should work on both my recording and reviewing techniques. xx
It's great that you've wanted to do a project for so long and now you have! If you read around on the site, you'll see the vigorous debate over the concept of "hook;" so you're not caught out alone there (I'm starting to refer to myself in the third person sometimes as 'DJ Hooker*!').. still if someone calls attention to your melody or lack of it it's good to both look at that, and not get so focused at looking at that that you start psyching yourself out (as I often do..).
Also, I do not feel like there are any "losers" here.. in a way we are all both losers and winners depending on how you look at it. I like the glass is half full approach; and some of my "worst" voted songs in both Songfight! and other reviewed contests have been my best material.
Sorry to yammer on, I just really feel strongly that learning to sit through the pages of critique is part of the whole point. I didn't start putting music up here until I could answer the question "would it bother me to cry over a song if told it sucked" with "no" or "only for a small while."
anyway...
...welcome to songfight.................. xxxx

*no, above is not another new fake dj name for a decoy piano pop act who Does Not spin.

RangerDenni wrote:Well.. this place is called song FIGHT. so you are probably not going to find a place filled with nothing but heart and lollipop-laden reviews.
A good way to become inured to them is to do some right-on-point, straight-to-the-bone critique yourself.

That's pretty spot-on. The review forums are really the beating, vicious heart of this community.

Here's my contribution to the blood-sport:

the last afternoon of a woman he only thought he knew

Overall, I think this continues a series of really strong fights.

BSS - I would've maybe EQ'd some of the mids out of the synth leading into the chorus to make them pop out a bit more, and perhaps knock the volume down on the chorus vox a little bit. Otherwise, I like this a lot.

bgm - Great bass guitar tone. I would've maybe turned up the dirty organ sound during the walking bassline and let it shine a little more. A big crazy ending would've been kind of cool, but it works the way it is, too.

Billy & The Psychotics - Nice chug! I do wonder if the bass is a bit overpowering or if it's just me. It's kind of right on the edge of ambiguity for me. I'm really digging the batshit guitar playing!

Dejected Motives - I don't hate the autotune, but I do think the vox are wayyyy too overpowering. I would cut the volume by at least half. Not entirely sure what you were trying to achieve with the 7 minute song length. I can appreciate songs that kind of go into a trance state that can justify that length, but this just doesn't quite reach that level. Conciseness can go a long way toward getting a musical idea across without letting the listener get bored. Also, I haven't had a chance to split those parts from last week's song yet, but I'll get those to you sometime this weekend hopefully.

Dirge - Good mix, until the distorted guitars come in. Turn those fuckers WAY UP and let this song get huge, because it sounds like it wants to be. Unfortunately it sounds like they're playing from another room. I would also maybe double the vox during that part. That's just probably a personal thing I would do, and I can't say for sure it'd be a good idea without hearing it.

DJ Ranger Den - Good singin', and the sparse arrangement works. I'm not very good at proffering advice on songs where the lyrics are the focal point, because I don't hear lyrics when I listen to music. Most of my favorite records I still don't know most of the words to. So... not really sure where I was going with that. They were probably good!

Emperor Gum - Be conscious of what the song needs from your vocals. They sound like they were recorded in a closet, while everything else sounds like it was in a bigger room, and it makes the mix sound disjointed. A little touch of reverb can go a long way, and EQing some of the higer frequencies from the vox might help also help it meld a bit with the other instrumentation.

Future Boy - The only advice I can give would probably just echo what I think I've seen in other reviews. I would've just put a bit more reverb on the vox, but otherwise this is fuckin' nice. That Rhodes was a good investment. I've always enjoyed the way you've used it.

Hip Hop Anonymous - Horrorcore isn't something that speaks to me. I like the beat, and don't really have any advice on the mix. It does what it does just fine.

Klownhole - I think this is Klownhole at least. The mp3 doesn't say, but this is going through in alphabetical order, and I think I remember this being yo' style. Reminds me of old Melvins. I would've perhaps put some reverb on the guitars to sort of match up with the vox a bit. I like the sludgy, sloppy guitar work, though.

Life in Decibels - Maybe it was a stylistic choice on your part, but it sounds to me like you aren't singing in your own voice. The skittery drums towards the end are a nice touch. So was the minute of silence at the end. haha

Mom & Data - Good atmosphere, and really nice mix. I think - and this is just me talking from a compositional standpoint because I feel engaged with this song - with the nearly one note vocal melody, I think I would've gradually introduced little changes as the song progressed to really help the slow build. Otherwise, I really liked this. Also, some people here are really concerned with a song having traditional pop song structures. Not every song needs a fucking hook, or a chorus, or any of that. Make it go how you want to make it go.

Paco del Stinko - Holy fuck, that's a nasty, nasty synth. I love it! I bet in a live scenario, this would melt the PA.

Pigfarmer Jr - I can't find much to say about this. I'm sorry. :-\

Ripping Hammer - Oh shit. That beat is niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice. Why is it so short!!!! You a Subtle fan, by chance?

SoS - I'm not sure why, but this brings Oxbow to mind. My personal preference wishes the vox were mixed a bit a lower, but I think that's just because I love the dissonance in the guitar and wish I could hear it a bit better during the verse. The aesthetic is impeccable as always, though.

Sportswriters - You know what you're doin'. My only criticism would just echo what's already been said about the drum beat. Apart from that, this does what it sets out to do quite nicely.

TC Elliott - Sounds like it's playing out of a boombox. The vocal melody is catchy, but they are a bit dry. I think a bit of reverb would go a long way here.

Wicked Cripple feat Don't Reply - That is a weird vocal effect! And that bass is deafening. Still, I'm not sure I would say to turn it down, because it kind of sells the insanity going on here.

Rock ---- Welcome, you still have feelings. You will get over it soon and get better. Try harder next time. cheers

Stinko---- was impressed by your vocals this time. (too old to care for this type of a vibe, never the less, you sang well). Do you have like pet snakes and shit?

My wife Dorie, regarding the sonofsupercar song this week: "who was THAT? That was kind of AWESOME."

Bgm i wanted a chorus for your song SO BAD OMFG. Torturous.

blue wrote:I heard a bunch of you say you wanted to remix the sos tune. Here are the raw tracks, nicely lined up and ready to roll.

http://www.sonofsupercar.com/music/sono ... tracks.zip

with apologies to the bass player.....

jack wrote:

blue wrote:I heard a bunch of you say you wanted to remix the sos tune. Here are the raw tracks, nicely lined up and ready to roll.

http://www.sonofsupercar.com/music/sono ... tracks.zip

with apologies to the bass player.....

Thanks Jack. Nice go of it, actually. It's pillowy. And chambery.
Swell use of the lead guitar in new spots other than the original to pointed pop effect.
I think it's in my contract that when forced to choose only one single vocal track of mine in a song, the producer must double it and move it's duplicate over a 1/10th of a second to create an obfuscatory and blissful temperance. I think that's how the lawyers put it, anyway.

jb wrote:My wife Dorie, regarding the sonofsupercar song this week: "who was THAT? That was kind of AWESOME."

Wives are the GREATEST!
Nowhere to go but down from here.

I am running late in everything this week, but can't blow off comments. Hastily done, ask for clarification, if you'd like.

Berkeley Social Scene - Ken "Knob Twiddler" Who? I like this better as it goes on. The pre-chorus, chorus are very nice, they make the return to the verses tastier. Good leads, of course.

bgm - Good fun. I undertand what JB was hankering for, but regardless, this is a tasty nugget of happy fun, despite the bad mis-goings on of the subjects. I like the dryness here, don't listen to'em.

Billy & The Psychotics - So it's a HARD rubber bass this week, so what? Good to hear BLT take lead vocals here and do some nice varied guitar lines. Somebody say half-step? Hard to go wrong there.

c.layne - Apparent master of the digital chip-chop, that, to me, is harder than doing 100 takes of a guitar (or whatever) line. I like the mysterioso melodies and superb layers throughout.

Dejected Motives - Bad mix, too long a duration as well. I like the almost Spaghetti Western guitar, a little, and the layers you try, but this is a bit of a mess. Re-focus and whittle the length down.

Dirge - Pink Floyd-ish, boy is it moody. Very nice guitar laying, I'd like to hear those layers vary and maybe come and go at different times. Backing voice(s) on chorus would be nice, as might an octave higher one on the end section.

DJ Ranger Den - The recording and mix may not shine, but not the main point here. You have the voice up front as it should be. Pleasant song, soothing at times, dreamy at others. Nice and patient flow as well, an underlying confdence.

Emperor Gum - Absolutely giant points for concept and attempt here. Tuning issues and some misplaced dissonance are points against. Tightened and re-done, this would be grand. The river pace and flow are very pleasant.

Future Boy - Love the intro, and the entry of the voice. I enjoyed these lyrics and story, melodies. The crash/gash bit is swell also, a bit of a surprise as it's so upbeat, with dark lyrics.

Hip Hop Anonymous - I kind of like the Exorcist music and that it sounds like you're having fun doing this in some Vincent Price manner. But I'd rather hear the lyrics spat out machine gun style, I think.

Klownhole - Is that Jesus on vocals, or someone else? One of my favorite SF! vocalists, regardless. Tense, skudgy, and temple pounding all at the same time, yet remarkably clear. Put that on an advertising banner.

Life in Decibels - I like the minimalism here, and the lonely-boy voice, but it still feels too thin and weak, somehow. Perhaps those same elements I like also work against. Hmm. Maybe a ripping buzzsaw sound...somewhere.

Mom&Data - I like the Radiohead bass line and the way the voice enters. Good, simple, yet effective layers draw you in to the swirly, slightly grey vibe. Dissonance works well here, it's a nice shake of pepper.

Paco del Stinko - I shat this out very quickly, if one can't tell. The bit crushed main instrument is actually an acoustic guitar, through a secret weapon (PM me, Mr. Car, if you gots to know). That and my MOOG are the only instruments.

Pigfarmer Jr - Yes indeed, this is quite a departure from your recent entries. I don't like the stiff vocals during the verses, but find the chorus, as harsh as it may be, effective. What would happen if you turned this into an acoustic song now?

Ripping Hammer - Syncopation works fine. I like the distant "ahh-ahh" voice but the other, not so much. The beat during the verse is good and there are hints of promise throughout that don't fully develop.

sonofsupercar - I understand the Jane's Addictione reference, I suppose, but this is much better than those guys, by far. Drumming is balls, and the guitar is wonderfully dissonant. Love the vocal and lyrics about...I have no idea. Future trivia question on bass.

Sportswriters - Way big New Pornographers Intro into a fine story. Imagery and complete come back around the bend to fulfill the story are top notch. I like the instrumentation here as well, and they all sound nice, to boot.

T.C. Elliott - This is simple, thick, and mostly fun. It may not have a long shelf life, but is fun as it goes by. Glad you turned off the tin can vocal sound for the chorus. A more moblie bass line would secretly breathe some heart into this.

Wicked Cripple feat. dont reply - This should be performed in a clown suit and make up. Is this a rehash from the past? Is it Crates? Hmm...I'm getting nervous.

jack wrote:

blue wrote:I heard a bunch of you say you wanted to remix the sos tune. Here are the raw tracks, nicely lined up and ready to roll.

http://www.sonofsupercar.com/music/sono ... tracks.zip

with apologies to the bass player.....

Nice job, Jack. Why'd you give up on the bass?

blue wrote:

jack wrote:

blue wrote:I heard a bunch of you say you wanted to remix the sos tune. Here are the raw tracks, nicely lined up and ready to roll.

http://www.sonofsupercar.com/music/sono ... tracks.zip

with apologies to the bass player.....

Nice job, Jack. Why'd you give up on the bass?

the bass was actually a ripping track (was that paco?) but I felt like the mix already had alot of mud in the middle.
and I was going for the Pollard 4 track sound with wall of guitars
you did a great job with his vocals. much better than me. fun!

So thank you to all who voiced their opinions of my tune. I do appreciate it. Seems like a few recurring themes...

Texture - A few people mentioned the sonic texture/mood of the song being interesting. Haven't recorded acoustic rhythmn guitars with electric leads lately. Seems like it worked well on this tune. I'll have to continue to do this.
Lyrics - So, basically overwhelming dislike for the lyrics. Someone said that using "retarded" once works well as an accent, using it repeatedly was lazy and ineffective. I'll have to give some of the lines added attention and see if I can't come up with something better.
Heavy breakdown - Yeah, the song didn't HIT at 2:50 like I envisioned it in my head. There's some very easy things I can do to rectify this. Still working on dynamics within Pro Tools - all my songs seem to come out at the same volume throughout. At least I've stopped using Maxim on the master stereo bus (see "Who Said I'm Dead").

In any event, I still feel like this is my best SF effort so far (save for the "Bag of Bones" attempt that I never submitted) so I'm glad for that. Really good fight by all.

dirgetheband wrote: Lyrics - So, basically overwhelming dislike for the lyrics. Someone said that using "retarded" once works well as an accent, using it repeatedly was lazy and ineffective. I'll have to give some of the lines added attention and see if I can't come up with something better.

fuck that.

blue wrote:

dirgetheband wrote: Lyrics - So, basically overwhelming dislike for the lyrics. Someone said that using "retarded" once works well as an accent, using it repeatedly was lazy and ineffective. I'll have to give some of the lines added attention and see if I can't come up with something better.

fuck that.

Yeah, but see, Ben Folds is saying "you make me feel retarded" while the Dirge song says "all of the others are retarded..." It's that fine line between stupid and clever.

(not calling your song stupid, just quoting spinal tap)

Paco Del Stinko wrote:
Sportswriters - Way big New Pornographers Intro into a fine story. Imagery and complete come back around the bend to fulfill the story are top notch. I like the instrumentation here as well, and they all sound nice, to boot.

Cheers, Paco, hadn't thought of the New Porno's reference although they are probably my favorite band of the last five years. I always used to get thrown when drumming along to them until I realized they were fucking with the time sig, then I was like 'oh NOW I GET IT'.

edit -- the Go-Betweens are probably my fave band of all time and they also fucked with the time sig but so subtly I didn't notice it for 20 years.

I'm finally caught up with reviews here...which means I did actually vote for the first time in awhile. Hated this title...and hated that most people didn't actually use it in the song (even though I know you don't have to).

http://spintown79.blogspot.com/2011/11/ ... on-of.html

Future Boy - I was enjoying the sound & lyrics (if not the performance) then WHAM you change things up pretty abruptly. Great story telling & way to use the title when so many others wussed out. (voted)

Hip Hop Anonymous - Creepy Michael Myers inspired music? I likes. Used the title. I likes. Clear story with mostly clever lyrics. I likes. Nice flow. (voted)

bgm - The music was good, but left me feeling like something was missing. I thought it was building to something (other than the disco flare) that never came. Lyrically I loved it aside from the fact the title wasn't used. (voted)

Sportswriters - "That winter was colder far than any that I remember" REALLY?! The very first line is a Yoda line? Change that stupid line cause otherwise this is a lovely song. Well done...even though...again...the title wasn't used. (voted)

Berkeley Social Scene - I know in Song Fight you don't have to use the title in the song, but as I've said in the past I like it when people do. You kinda cheated to do that, and even still it sounded awkward. The song aside from that part sounded fine. Nice work. I can't blame you too much for not finding a way to work the really crappy title into the song.

Billy & The Psychotics - Not enough of a story for me & the chorus sounded too messy for my liking. No title in the song.

DJ Ranger Den - No title in the song. I got the big picture, but the journey to it wasn't to my liking. Nice to hear your guitar again.

c.layne - Vocally it was a nice performance. Musically it was interesting, but a few sounds just annoyed me. For instance the very first sound in the track. Then whatever came in with about 1:50 left in the track. And 50 seconds later makes me think about when I put a bad CD in my CD player. Lyrically it wasn't my cup of tea. Didn't hear the title.

Dejected Motives - 15 seconds in & I'm guessing this is going to be tough to listen to. Music starts off bad, can't hardly make out the vocals, and I see you decided to waste 7 whole minutes of my time. Lets see if I have to edit this review after listening to the other 6 minutes & 45 seconds... ...Nope...I was right on the money. It is possible you used the entire title...as I said it was hard to make out the vocals.

Dirge - Starts off with a lack of flow. Seriously it sounds like a little kid trying to be careful to say everything correctly as he's reading in front of the class. It gets better as it goes, but never really grabs me, even when you totally change it up at the end.

Emperor Gum - Graham...over a minute to get to the lyrics? Musically I didn't care for it at all, which makes it worse that it took so long for vocals. Your recording of vocals has improved a lot over the past year or so, and there's some emotion in them which is often lacking in your past offerings. Still needs work though.

Wicked Cripple feat. dont reply - Bring up the vocals. You used the title...YAY. That's as positive as I can possibly get with this.

Klownhole - Sloppy.

Life In Decibels - The last 70 seconds were the best part, other than the use of the title.

Mom&Data - Lyrically it starts off like it might be interesting, but never really goes anywhere. I stopped caring halfway through.

Paco del Stinko - What is that blaring noise? It's more obnoxious than Sammy Kablam. Lyrically I liked it...but that sound was enough for me not to hit play again.

Pigfarmer Jr - Flow...get some. The hook...terrible. Music...dull & repetitive.

Ripping Hammer - What few vocals there were I had trouble picking up. Just...start over...completely.

sonofsupercar - Lyric archive...use it. Couldn't understand parts of it. Has an old feel to it. Not for me, but better than most this fight.

T.C. Elliott - If a certain afternoon is so important that it's being longed for in the chorus maybe we should know a little about it? Didn't care for the singing & the whole song never really goes anywhere. No title again.

Spintown wrote:c.layne - Didn't hear the title.

I figured since it was in lower case it was a subject matter instead of a title.

Spintown wrote:
sonofsupercar - Lyric archive...use it.

Song Fight.... Enter one.

The very first line is a Yoda line?

Deal with it, you must.