The Song Fight Bulletin Board

Most of us ripped off Willie Nelson...

Re: Adam Adamant

The judges have discussed this matter and have come to a conclusion. Seeing as 20 bands had entered timely entries and the addition of one more would create an elimination situation, we are regretfully denying Adam Adamant's late entry into Round One.

Manhattan Glutton wrote:Most of us ripped off Willie Nelson...

Except governing's Counting Crows rip off.
....rip off used sarcastically loose, of course. It also happens to be my top pick, thus far.

Hey look, there's artwork.

Thank you judges and Niv for letting me know. See you all next year!

Nur Ein!

I've had a couple listens, impressive everyone!

Ross- you're my early favorite! Great song!
Merisan- Freaking perfect!
Man Glut- love the guitar hook! Great song!
Ken- Great song! Love the solo!
Frankie- ummmm this rocks! That vocal melody is quite the nod to "Destination Ursa Major".
http://vimeo.com/m/23694128
The 3rd and 4th lines of the Super Drag verse sound like your vocal hook.

Adam- bummer! You had a great song!

No time for reviews right now, most of you deserve shout outs, I'll get reviews out after some more listening.


Nur Ein!

Billy's Little Trip wrote:

Manhattan Glutton wrote:Most of us ripped off Willie Nelson...

Except governing's Counting Crows rip off.
....rip off used sarcastically loose, of course. It also happens to be my top pick, thus far.

I was going to say something about being shocked and appalled by this unfounded accusation but then I remembered I once almost subtitled a Spintunes entry "I think Adam Duritz Is Gonna Sue Somebody" so I guess I should probably just take it....

Glad you like it.

glennny wrote:I've had a couple listens, impressive everyone!

Ross- you're my early favorite! Great Song!

Nur Ein!

Wow, thanks man. Can't wait to see if the judges agree

glennny wrote: Frankie- ummmm this rocks! That vocal melody is quite the nod to "Destination Ursa Major".
http://vimeo.com/m/23694128
The 3rd and 4th lines of the Super Drag verse sound like your vocal hook.

I love Superdrag and I will be the first to confess that everything I write is derivative of something else, but if we're giving Superdrag credit for the major scale, we're all in trouble.

Glad you thought my tune rocked. Those changing meters during the waltz are for you.

Tonight I'll be hosting the Nur Ein 8 Round 1 Listening Party on UStream
Show starts at 8 pm EDT. Preshow is starting now.

The Google+ Hangout won't be happening this time because computer fun.

Drop on in if you have some time. 21 new songs created just for this contest, and we'll whittle them down to 'Only One'.

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/nur-ein

The chat room is on Chatzy here
http://www.chatzy.com/85010334701393

or irc here at SongFight
http://jan-krueger.net/sf-irc

Here are some reviews. Like the songs, some are better than others.

Balance Lost - I like this. It has kind of a Pedro the Lion feel or maybe Badly Drawn Boy. The vocals seem a little lower-fi than the music for some reason. I guess I'd like to see it go somewhere bigger which may be more obvious than what you were going for. (I tend to do obvious shit and I realize that's not what everyone wants to do.) As it is, it hangs in a sort of stasis. Interesting tune.

Boffo Yux Dudes - Maybe I don't understand what a looking glass is? I thought it was just a mirror. If that's the case, I think the title is kind of forced even though the tune is clever and the lilt of the waltz time works so well in this context.

Carlo Bruno, Jr. - I love the first verse. And I really like the unbridled passion of the song. It's noisy and almost out of control. I'm not sold on your voice yet, but I think I can be convinced. Nice one.

Cavedwellers - Great recording. I find the song to be a little on the bland side. I think I would have tried to layer some descant vocals on the last verse and/or chorus. The pulse seems a bit labored to me.

Chokehold Princess - You are the scariest competitor in this thing. A real wild card. This is funny and doesn't overstay its welcome (by much).

Dani House - That's a lot reverb considering there isn't any on the instruments. May want to balance that out a bit. You have the unlucky fortune of following a uke song with more uke and a glock song with more glock. I like the accordion. I can't get past the disembodied voice. Would like to listen with lyrics.

DJ Ranger Den - Starts like a torch song with nice chromatic inflections but quickly morphs into a show tune. And then it becomes a Satie Gymnopedie. Interesting tune worthy of repeat listening.

Governing Dynamics - I tried to avoid making this argument in the Cavedwellers song but I wonder if the judges will hear songs that are in 6/8 as "waltzes." The beat stress is different. This sounds like it was mixed by the guitar player - guitar is very loud in the mix. I don't have much to say about the song. It's not bad.

Inflatable Vegetables - I hate this type of thing. Clipping didn't help. Mercifully short!

Jon Eric - This is SO much like a song from a musical, it's not even funny. I find the concept so icky, it's hard to give it a fair review. Nice piano playing as usual.

Ken Mahru - Country-style waltz! It sounds like maybe you had some writers block this week. The song arrangement is good but production not up to your standards. Lyrics okay but not what I would expect from you. I'm looking forward to your stuff this time around. This one is more of a single than a home run.

Manhattan Glutton - More country-style! This style is a good fit for your voice. This song has a sadness to it that I can appreciate. I like the low guitar sound but I think it's overused. Bass seems loud in my speakers but that's not uncommon here. I kind of like this.

Merisan - This is pleasant. And dressed up nicely. I like the chorus pretty much but the verses...enh. But I still love you both!

Paco del Stinko - Intro sounds like the Motel 6 commercials. "Nary." You are brave. The lyrical approach is kind of obvious but the little refrain and break-up at the end justify the choice. Nice guitar work in the middle.

Ross Durand - So many minor key songs this week! I would love to know what it's like in your studio when you're recording these guitar parts. I imagine you are the most confident guy in the world and you just nail it on the first take. This is a lovely arrangement. Great job.

Sky Pup - Scale practice! Oh. That was unfortunate.

Tubba Gutz - I definitely don't want to hear this again, BUT I would like to hear you again. So not a total loss.

The Tydon Docks - Haha. You said Tubbgutz. This is actually not bad. I don't know if it's really a waltz but it's in fast triple time so I guess it's close enough. I fear the coarseness may be a turnoff for many. Why did you censor the lyrics you posted?

WreckdoM - This has a really interesting soundscape. Reminds me of The Residents or something you'd hear in a David Lynch film. I thought the repetition was going to be annoying (because the verses and chorus are so similar) but it's not - it's kind of hypnotic and pleasant. I like this tune a lot. Nice work!

frankie big face wrote: I wonder if the judges will hear songs that are in 6/8 as "waltzes." The beat stress is different.

Viennese Waltzes are still waltzes.

Generic wrote:

frankie big face wrote: I wonder if the judges will hear songs that are in 6/8 as "waltzes." The beat stress is different.

Viennese Waltzes are still waltzes.

I don't know what you mean by this. Viennese waltzes are in 3/4.

they're also in 6/8
waltzes come in 5/4 too (hesitation waltz)
I think any triple feeling time sig can be a waltz.

I checked before I went forth with the 6/8. (My band-mate happens to be a music scholar.)

Cavedwellers - Great recording. I find the song to be a little on the bland side. I think I would have tried to layer some descant vocals on the last verse and/or chorus. The pulse seems a bit labored to me.

recording-Thanks! Bland-bummer , Descant vocals: awesome idea! with more time that would be an excellent choice!, Labored pulse: that's my fault, I like the groove, but I think i know what you mean.

My opinions are stupid. Don't listen to me. Unless I said something nice. Then okay.

Balance Lost - Love the intro. The music, as always, is very solid and appreciated. Vocals feel a bit weaker than usual. You lose me at the chorus, where it's not nearly as tight as the amazing verse.

Boffo yux dudes - You can do the jokey song thing, that's fine, but the jokey voice... is like nails on a chalkboard.

Carl - I don't know who you are, but the schtick is funny. Your voice sounds a little bit like smash mouth. The composition and music is great. If you sang a little bit less abrasively, this could actually pass real song muster.

Cavedwellers - I like the chord changes. Great performances on all the parts - and lots of interesting parts there are. If you changed out the instruments, this could pass for a boy band or emo song. Not that I'd like that better.

Chokehold - It's funny, but I don't really want to listen again.

Dani - Nice clean instrument sounds - they work for you on the verse and against you on the first chorus. The instruments that do come in later, while probably what you were going for, are a bit too much cacophony for me. Some additional melodic elements would be great instead of more percussion.

DJ - You're doing a lot of your a-melodic staccato - you need to rock your voice, girl. I feel the potential, but it seems a bit thrown-together-in-short-time-ish.

Frankie - Well, you know how to impress the judges. The chord structure is kind of bland and doesn't impress me. The out of tune guitars are a cool effect. I like the drums throughout.

GD - The atmosphere is cool. I like some of the solo things you're doing. The vocals are iffy. I'm not a huge fan of this particular sub-genre of alternative rock, so I can't really say anything helpful or constructive at this point.

Inflatable veg - Another joke song. I can't really give you any feedback.

Jon Eric - Oh hey, I think I like you in 3/4. Great harmonies on the chorus! The second verse is kind of ... weird with that delay/verb. I think I would particularly enjoy this more if it were filled out.

Ken - Way to take away my plodding country thunder, jerk-hole. Awesome chorus. Vocal melody/delivery is a bit bland in comparison - it's like the song exists only for the chorus, which is not a bad thing by any means. The rat-tat-tat-tat-tat-tat of the snare is a bit over-played, IMO.

Merisan - Very pretty. I enjoy the chord choice and melody line. It's deliciously thin. The drums almost feel a bit unnecessary, as the snare on the "2 and" beat is debatably grating over such a sweet song. I love when you guys duet.

Paco - Not a huge fan of the verse drums. For some reason, drums in waltzes get on my nerves, go figure, right? I like the key change. The general chord plodding is a bit kitschy. Nice slide guitar work!

Ross - This is fucking good. It seems you're bringing your A game, and I like your A game. I am also very jealous.

Sky Pup - This is a joke song. I normally loathe joke songs. This one made me chuckle, and I have accidentally not skipped it at least twice.

Tubba Gutz - You have some great ideas, and you're actually good at rapping. You just need to practice your production and engineering skills. Don't get discouraged if people don't like it.

Tydon - This is okay. I like the slide guitar parts. I don't really like joke songs, but it could work if it weren't so thin - I like the last few iterations of the chorus. I will say last week's song has been my favorite from you ever, so maybe there's hope for you yet.

WreckdoM - This is fantastic - the atmosphere, the performance, everything. The duet parts just bring such a great vibe. And with the one weird instrument to add the spookiness. Very good! Where's the vote button? One thing I will say is that some of your "ess" sounds come through distorted (may I guess that this is from pitch correction? I won't hate.)

Looking Glass

Cavedwellers- My project. We were distracted with another project for much of the week. We were much farther behind than I wanted to be on Saturday. I spent a late night and made a finished project. Then in the morning I heard what Lee was brewing. It was awesome. It required a lot of additional parts and rearrangement. Luckily we've been writing together for 20 years and we can speak shorthand and execute quickly. I’m glad we dug in and made his version happen. I love the result. I’m happy with the way the mix turned out this time. Lee gave me phenomenal tracks: vocals, nylon string guitar, banjo. There were a lot of choices with a lot of tracks. I hope they were good ones, I know they weren't always the best, but one must finish!

I can’t be objective about the Cavedwellers, here’s how I rank the rest:

Ross Durand- The genius of this is the patience it has. When the big band comes in it is so incredibly satisfying. The acoustic sounds incredible, and the playing is superb. I like the lyrics. I love your vocal delivery throughout! Awesome!
Balance Lost- This is lovely! It feels like Friz should take a verse, Mel should add some oohs and ahs, and I should do an eBow solo. This evokes much sentimentality is what I mean. I love your voice, I love the bass line. This is awesome. You don’t need us, it’s just awesome, makes me want to be a part of it. Nothing to criticize. You own twee. I guess I wish the kick punched me in the chest rather than tapped me on the back of the head. I don’t think I will tire of hearing this. Bravo!

Merisan- Flawless! Vocals are so amazing! Sam sounds great, Erin sounds awesome! Great melodies! I’m really glad you have the snare there. This is sooo beautiful! Amazing production and execution!

Ken- The drums are great, nitpick: is the kick softer than usual? Your voice is great! I really like the guitar solo, those bends are great! I love how heavy the one is. Great playing on all the instruments!

Paco del Stinko- The production and mix is fantastic! I’m not sure this vocal personality was the right one for this song. I’d like to hear an octave down in the Elvis Cash range. What a great ending! All the details of this recording make me smile! You’re such a great player! Are those rods on the drums? Great job!

Carl Bruno Jr- Thank you for a nice loud kick! The drums really make the song for me! Great energy in this song! I like the guitar tone. Your unique voice and the killer drums make this song really intriguing.

Frankie Big Face- I wish the kick was louder. This is power pop gold. I mean it’s Superdrag, with the We Can Work it Out Beatles challenge fulfillment, with David Bowie back-ups. How does one compete? Vocals are phenomenal as usual! Yeah the time changes are groovy and delicious. I still hate the fade outs, just figure out how we’ll end it live if I’m in your band

*Adam Adamant- DQ’d . Too bad! This is great. I don’t know what you really look like, but in my mind you are David J (love and rockets/ Bauhaus). Your voice really sounds great in this range and this mix. The lead synth is really fun!

Governing Dynamics- I had forgotten why you sounded so familiar. Remember Spintunes 2? I was the Song Fight asshole judge. Wow man! Your recordings sound a zillion times better than (2 years?) ago. Your vocal delivery in this song is fantastic! I’ll take you over Adam any day. I love the drums and guitar, it sounds very Modest Mouse circa lonesome Crowded West. This is a great song! Good Job!

Manhattan Glutton- That little guitar hook is so catchy! Nice melodies! Lovely harmonies! Was it worth it lyrically to sing about glasses they look at etc, rather than a mirror? I like most of the lyrics, the title feels really shoehorned and confused. I LOVE the bridge! Anyway, this is a great song! Nicely done!

Jon Eric- Playing your strengths! Jon and a piano! I think the echo use is brilliant. That gimmick could have gone horribly wrong, but you pulled it off. I wish you omitted the “…. good thing you finished this song, how did we do….” It really pulled me out of the song. However other than that lyric violation, I really like this song. Nice concept, melody and playing!

Wreckdom- Nice and moody! Nice to hear the straight singing! This is haunting. I think more of a change up would strengthen this a lot. The female vocals are very pretty! This could use an ending as well. Very cool!

Chokehold Princess- This is hilarious! I know it’s coming after the 1st listen but it makes me laugh every time. It’s deliciously absurd. The recording is terrible, but seems to be on purpose, and it works.

Dani House- This is pretty. I’m glad you went big halfway through. Not sure about the electric, but at least it’s subtle. Nice dynamics. Good stuff!

The Tydon Dicks- When it’s super tight, it’s awesome, when it gets loose not so much. This is funny! Reminds me of the Cheerful Insanity of Giles Giles and Fripp. I want to see a musical you score someday. There would only be one scene: a bar. It will be great. Nice story, lyrics are very entertaining! I like it! I can’t let my kids hear this. It is catchy and they will start calling everybody a cunt. Fun!

Tubba Gutz- The drums are irritating. The rap is good. I know you’re a genius. I hope you unleash it before it’s too late. This is really ripe for remixing. Love to hear what Furry Pedro would do with these tracks. Yeah I’m with you on the keys and the vocals, just not the drums.

DJ Ranger Denn- Nice playing. Nice singing. I can’t wrap my brain around the structure. Do you chart these compositions? I’d love to see your charts or notes. To me, it sounds improvised, but maybe you have a scheme.

Boffo Yux Dudes- I’d love to hear you guys take yourself seriously. I think it would actually be funnier if it were delivered straight, letting the content hold the funny. It’s a cute song.

Inflatable Vegetables- Silly song. Nice length, appropriate for a comedy song. This feels like the music game on Who’s Line is it Anyway. It’s funny. The music and melody is super obvious. Now I want to hear “Shaving Cream, be nice and clean, shave everyday and you’ll always look keen”. Enjoyable.

Sky Pup- Sorry I’m ranking you this low. I actually really enjoyed this. This cracked me up. I thought this was Sleeping Beauty, but she wasn't a warlock. The recording is awful, but you make up for it with guts.

glennny wrote:they're also in 6/8
waltzes come in 5/4 too (hesitation waltz)
I think any triple feeling time sig can be a waltz.

I checked before I went forth with the 6/8. (My band-mate happens to be a music scholar.)

I don't have an issue with it; I was just pondering how 6/8 would be perceived by judges. I've personally never seen a waltz written in 6/8 but it's not a style I conduct frequently. While listening I tried to imagine dancing a waltz to those tunes in 6/8 and they seemed a bit awkward to me, that's all.

Perhaps you and/or Jon could point me in the direction of a piece of sheet music that shows a waltz written in 6/8. I'd be curious to see this.

The rest of my reviews:

Carlo Bruno Jr
Governing Dynamics
WreckdoM
Chokehold Princess

Cavedwellers - This has really grown on me after a few more listens so I'm moving it up in my rankings. There really is a lot to love about this.

The Tydon Docks
Frankie Big Face
Adam Adamant

Merisan - This is beautiful. I really love both of your voices. You have made a wonderful, pretty song.

DJ Ranger Den

Manhattan Glutton - This song is pretty cool. It had some nice vocal and guitar lines. It could have used a catchy chorus or hook to make it really stand out.

Ken Mahru - A well done song. Sounds pretty slick. The song itself didn't particularly grab me. Some of the guitar was pretty sweet.

Jon Eric
Balance Lost

Ross Durand - This is how country music should sound. The country singing in Boffo's song turned me off their song, but this is very listenable. It gets epic when the strings come in. Nicely done.

Paco del Stinko - This song has an odd quality about it that I can definitely appreciate. It is a fun song that I could certainly waltz to.

Boffo Yux Dudes
Dani House
Tubba Gutz
Inflatable Vegetables

frankie big face wrote:
Perhaps you and/or Jon could point me in the direction of a piece of sheet music that shows a waltz written in 6/8. I'd be curious to see this.

To be fair, my main source is my wife, who was a semi-pro ballroom dancer for a number of years. Every song I've ever shown her in 6/8 time, she says "I could Viennese Waltz to this."

I did a quick Google and came up with this... http://www.traditionalmusic.co.uk/folk- ... _waltz.png

Unfortunately, I can't seem to locate most of my old non-digital sheet music. I was hoping to thumb through some Chopin and Brahams to come up with an example, but I don't know for sure whether either of those would turn up anything anyway.

Maybe you're hearing the time signatures differently from me? Here are some examples of my songs that Allyson has pegged as candidates for Viennese Waltz. I think they're 6/8, but maybe I've mis-categorized them.
Let It Roll
Put Up With Me (some loose half-measures make this less danceable, but still)
Covenant, FL
Maritime Winds

Oof, that last one is tough to listen to these days. I can scarcely believe I used to consider that my best work. Here's an example of a non-me Song Fight track that she says you can waltz to. Again, I'm hearing 6/8 or 6/4. Let me know if you're hearing different.

Josh Woodward - "Big Disco"

My "issue" (really a non-issue—I'm not trying to make a big deal of this) with 6/8 versus 3/4 is the number of stressed beats. A waltz in 3/4 has one stressed beat (beat one) and is therefore conducted in one with every beat receiving the same weight. 6/8 has two stressed beats (the first and fourth eighth notes) and is conducted in two but those stresses are not equal. In a 6/8 march, beat one carries more weight than beat 2, for example. In pop music, the backbeat (in this case, beat 2) usually gets more stress. So, when I think of a waltz, and especially when I think of the dance, I expect the stress of the downbeat to be consistent and equal.

But hey, Wikipedia does have one sentence with no supporting evidence or citation stating that waltzes are found in 2/4 or 6/8 and even 5/4 so who am I to question?

Also, the specific type of waltz (sautuese) that Wikipedia cites as being 6/8, according to further research, appears to actually be in 2/4.

The subject (of waltzes in tertiary meters other than 3/4) was discussed (with little or no resolution) here:
http://forums.bobdunsire.com/forums/arc ... 44659.html

Sample excerpt:

Highland pipe books have dozens of waltzes written in 6/8 time. I guess it's the influence of the march idiom or whatever, but these tunes when played have a clear waltzlike feel, and really should have twice as many barlines as they do.

It's arbrirary anyhow, as many of these tunes are traditional songs from the Gaelic aural tradition and as such were passed down by ear without being written, until Pipe Major So-and-so decided to write it down in 6/8.

...

Sounds like a lazy copyist, who didn't want to write in all the barlines.