The Song Fight Bulletin Board

Good summary

Frist was able to attach his fucking online gambling bill to a ports security bill, even after it was shot down by itself, and then shot down from being attached to a different nat'l security bill.

What the bill essentially does is make it illegal for banks and isp's to facilitate US citizens access to gambling websites. This doesn't sound like a huge deal, but it has already crippled the industry. The bill passed Friday, and Monday UK-based Partypoker (the giant of online poker) took a %60 loss (roughly $7 billion US). They followed by cutting off service to all US customers (about %80 of their base). Nearly all big poker sites have followed suit, closing their doors to US consumers. This bill hasn't even been signed by Bush yet.

Funny side note, this bill explicitly protects HORSE RACING. It will continue to be ok to bet away on horses, yet playing $1/$2 limit hold'em online will be a crime punishable by 5 years imprisonment.

There are a lot of people who make a living at this game. The singer for my band just bought and furnished a very nice house, and bought a ridiculous engagement ring, all off of poker winnings. I've been studying with him for months so that I could start making some serious income off the game as well. Now he's completely fucked. He may have to up and move to Vegas. Frist may have just killed my band.

Nevermind that thousands of people are losing their livelyhoods, but millions (900,000 on partypoker alone) are losing a game they love to play.

The real issue here is that this is one of the biggest (successful) steps by government to regulate 'the internets.' If they don't like what you're doing online, they don't have to make it illegal, they just have to make it illegal for banks and isp's to facilitate it, and your bank/isp will make damn sure you don't do it.

Of course there are loopholes and workarounds, but the fact is that this bill was able to get through on the interest of an extreme fringe group of ultra-conservatives, when nowadays poker is on pretty much every channel on tv, free hold'em tournaments are popping up at every little sports bar, and people are buying chipsets and tables for home use. Practically everyone plays poker, and now the one place that people could go to play without driving to Vegas/AC/reservations is gone.

Just seeing if non poker freaks care. Poker forums are on fire of course. No word if anyone's killed themselves yet. For some of them, it really is like the stockmarket crash.

Thoughts?

As long as I can still play go fish.

I thought PartyPoker overreacted, or at least acted too soon (though maybe they had to because they're such a high profile public company.) The jury's still out on whether or not the new law applies to NetTeller, FirePay, et al.: http://www.businessweek.com/technology/ ... technology (and indeed, whether it even applies to online poker.) A lot of the Poker sites are taking a wait-and-see approach: http://www.fulltiltpoker.com/poker-blog/

I can see why your singer is bummed, though. The short term effect of this has to be fewer "fish".

deshead wrote:I can see why your singer is bummed, though. The short term effect of this has to be fewer "fish".

Anytime something gets shaken up in the industry, fish get scared away for a while. Like when paypal stopped doing poker transfers, everyone thought it was the end of the world.

My buddy plays high enough limits that there aren't really many fish, so that kind of thing affects me more than him. I'm not playing until this thing gets resolved. Cashed out my bankroll and everything.

Neteller took a huge hit, I don't recall the percentile.

As far as Party's quick withdrawal, there are rampant conspiracy theories flying about regarding intent to sell out to US brick and mortar casinos. I don't think that holds water, but it's certainly odd to block %80 of your customers on the heels of a law that doesn't hold jurisdiction over you.

The ultra-optimistic hopes are that US casinos will buy out the online giants, then use their lobbying muscle to relegalize. Suddenly people can log onto MGMpoker.com and deposit straight from their credit card, no middleman required. A heavenly choir sings, and my guitar closet resumes growth.

I don't really play poker, but I think this is really crappy. Especially attaching it to a port security bill. F-ing politicians. Frist is a jerk.
-bill

dan do you have any twos?

Go fish, Denyer. Have any queens?

If you think this is just the work of ultra-conservatives, you missed the Abramoff scandal. Do you know how much money from Indian gambling revenue heads into the GOP to be disguised as moral concern?

But yes, this threatens to rob me of my temporary primary source of income. And the average "Let's throw away some spare cash," player has pretty much left, judging from the skimpy look of my last withdrawal. Sad times ahead?

fodroy wrote:Go fish, Denyer. Have any queens?

I have one.

If I were on my own computer, I'd change the pic that directs to to be something like 'DENYER LIKES SEMEN STEW' or something. Then I would ell oh ell.

The Sober Irishman wrote:this bill was able to get through on the interest of an extreme fringe group of ultra-conservatives

A group that will protect fucking tobacco companies while nearly half a million people die every year from smoking it in this country alone! Screw gambling, the largely innocuous trite distraction that it is.

Gambling, schmambling - you Seppos don't know the meaning of the word!

Pop down my way for a week - 10 to 1 I'll open your eyes! Come to the Pokie Palaces of the Gold Coast - every night is Elvis impersonator night! But we don't just ghetto-ise is in tawdry Las Vegas ripoffs - No! Try buying a newspaper at the newsagent - you have to line up behind 200 other bastards buying there lotto/pools/superball/lottery...etc. etc. tickets and scratchies - and every local pub is now a Card-ino!

If there was one thing I noticed on my recent trip to California - it was how very, very few opportunities there were for me to unload myself of unwanted money on every street corner [/rant]

One of the consoling anthems this week is 'prohibition didn't work with alcohol, it won't work with gambling'

They claim it's to stop the addicts. History has shown that making a genuine addict a criminal doesn't help the problem, it makes it worse.

Agh, I'm so mad. Fuck Frist, fuck everything.

It's pretty lame. I think some Democrats want to push rules through the Congress to make it so every bill has to be voted on by itself, without any of this BS (and it would also put a serious hold on earmarks/pork.) Maybe not every bill by itself (that would make defense bills insaaaaaaaaaane) but there would have to be... what is word... germaneness in a way that isn't currently respected.

The House of Representatives is a joke nowaday. Some may be aware they passed the same bill overwhelmingly in July, and the Senate only got around to it last week under very sketchy circumstances; the House is so I'll-scratch-your-back, and so gerrymandered, that nothing of much value gets done through there.

Plus it seems like any old jackass can get elected to the House (considering the "Internet is made of tubes!" kind of intellect level there...).

Interestingly - though Australians spend more per captita on gambling than almost every other nation on earth (we more than double what the USA spends - and we have more than 20% of the world's poker machines here!) - on-line gambling was banned here quite a long time ago.

I don't know if the ban actually works - or whether you can still gamble through overseas sites - but we have so many other options, I don't recall it ever being much of an issue.

Just an update: Everone on earth is now playing at PokerStars.

Partypoker, 888, Paradise, and pretty much every other major poker room on the net folded to US customers within a week of the act's passing. Stars was the only room to stand up and give the US government the finger, and there has been a mass exodus. Two months ago there were five heavyweight sites, now there is pokerstars. The rake is lower, the lobby is easier to navigate, the games start more often, and the fish are biting.

I'm a couple weeks away from being able to have poker suppliment my music income.

Mkilly wrote:It's pretty lame. I think some Democrats want to push rules through the Congress to make it so every bill has to be voted on by itself, without any of this BS (and it would also put a serious hold on earmarks/pork.) Maybe not every bill by itself (that would make defense bills insaaaaaaaaaane) but there would have to be... what is word... germaneness in a way that isn't currently respected.

True test of integrity coming up- do they still push for this now that the Democrats rule congress? I hope so. My cynicism will be reinforced if they don't.

Has such a bill actually been proposed yet? I do hope they do.
-bill