The Song Fight Bulletin Board

Hey all,

I want to put together a new PC for the home studio, customized for pro audio. I'm trying to put together a powerful system that will run my Sonar and Pro Tools programs. Sites like CyberPower look promising, but all the options are daunting for me (motherboards, etc).

I don't play video games...just make music. Anybody out there good and configuring custom systems?

BK

I'll be watching this thread. I'm about ready to step up "studio de Trip"

In the summer I set out to build the perfect DAW PC. This is what I got:

• A Quad-Core processor. DAWs see the greatest performance benefit from multi-core processors: a quad-core CPU will give you a >300% VST performance boost over an identically-clocked single-core CPU. I chose the Intel Q6600.
• Either a P35 or X38 chipset motherboard. Get one with a 1333hz FSB if you plan to overclock, or plan to eventually sell the PC to someone who will overclock. Get one with decent cooling--anything with a nice tall stack 'o copper on the northbridge will do fine--and make sure it has at least 4 ram slots. I wouldn't worry about DDR3 support. Firewire. I cheaped-out a little and got the ASUS P5K or some similar variant, but it has worked fine for me.
• 4gb (two identical 2 gig sticks) of dual-channel DDR2-800 with the fastest timings you can find (if you see "CAS 4-4-4-12" in the description, that's good. Higher numbers are slower). I wouldn't worry about the brand too much, although some of the fancier ones come with ram-heatsinks.
• At least two hard drives. Use one for your OS and the other for your audio tracks, samples, etc, as well as storage. I hear of some people using three harddrives, two of them set up in a striped RAID configuration, but for me that's overkill. I got two SATA2 500gb drives (with 32mb of cache: more is definitely better for DAWs), but these days you might as well get terabyte drives, because they're not too expensive. The Seagate Barracuda is the quietest low-end drive I've used.
• A case built specifically for silent computing. I recommend the Antec Sonata line. I've had Sonata's II and III; they are both quiet.
• Some mediocre videocard. If it can't play videogames, you'll probably be more productive. I, for instance, made the mistake of getting a videocard that can run Team Fortress 2. Also, huge top-of-the-line videocards tend to have loud fans. You do not want those. If possible, buy a fanless VGA heat sink to replace the factory one; removing my videocard's fan cut my PC noise in half. Try to get one with multiple DVI or HDMI outputs.
• Some DVD burner. Who cares.

So, that's the tower. But you're gonna need some extra stuff to get the most out of your PC.

• Wireless mouse and keyboard. The less cables the better, because you'll undoubtedly have plenty of other cables vying for desk space.
• A nice external audio interface. I'd recommend going Firewire over USB, as the serial bus gets shared for too much stuff these days. No sense letting IR signals from your wireless mouse preempt your valuable incoming audio.
• Two 20-inch (or larger) widescreen LCD displays. Put 'em side by side. You haven't used Cubase/ProTools/Sonar/etc until you've used them at a 3400px horizontal resolution. I can't go back.
• Nice, shielded nearfield monitors.
• Maybe one of those fake-y mixing-board controllers. I've got one and, meh, I could live without it.
• An awesome desk. I got one with lots of levels: a lower level for my tower, a drop tray for my mouse/keyboard/sandwich, a large main surface for a midi-keyboard or the controller I mentioned, a raised pedestal large enough to hold two widescreen LCDs side-by-side, and then two little 'ear' shelves to hold your monitors. Oh, and wheels, which is totally essential so you can move it around when your studio gets overcrowded with other toys.

Note that all this information is about 6 months old, so there may be some totally new processor/chipset innovations that I'm not aware of.

Good luck. Building PCs, while fun, can drive one stark raving mad.

Agree on a lot of that, especially the quiet PC - It's such a huge difference using an Antec case. I built my Windows system from a barebones AMD machine put together by endpcnoise.com, although my internet connection just went to heck for no reason (this happens every morning at home, I can't load SongFight and a few other things for about 10 minutes). Anyway, also do follow the advice to split the OS and programs on one drive and audio data on the other. It's good organization and it's better for the system and recording. Not sure if the external audio interface is necessary; I have had good success with my M-Audio Delta internal card - perhaps Adam! could explain his reason behind that preference, that would be helpful.
Now if Windows would be less flaky, that would be lovely... I have compromised and play games on the same PC also
-bill

...and as if my computer resented my comment about Windows, it crashed with a brand new BSOD five minutes later.
-bill

I did this about a year or so ago. I knew I wanted to run Cubase and use my MOTU 828mk2, so I checked a bunch of audio boards to see what systems people had used successfully. It seems to have worked. It was a bitch to get it all up and running, and I think the main thing is to do all the tweaks you can to optimize it for audio. I went with a single 22" widescreen LCD which rules! I saw a 24" on sale the other day too, so get as big and beefy as you can, but make sure it is stable, and if you can, stay away from Vista!

Ken

HeuristicsInc wrote:Not sure if the external audio interface is necessary; I have had good success with my M-Audio Delta internal card - perhaps Adam! could explain his reason behind that preference, that would be helpful.

I've had high-noisefloor problems with internal cards before. I suspect it wasn't the card, but actually that my case wasn't well grounded; as long as your interface has a break-out box, you should be able to avoid any serious noise issues. Also, I like for my audio interfaces to last a couple generations of PCs, but with PCI being phased out I'm not sure how long an internal one will be supported. That said, there's probably some great PCI-X soundcard out there, but I'm not aware of it.

Anyone want to divulge how much they spent to build their dream machine? I am just curious, I have no money.

I'm currently considering a studio upgrade myself. I have a crusty old PC and the world's cheapest DAW software.

It's really time to get something a little more serious, including some respectable mics and mic pres.

I'm thinking of making the switch to a Mac. Anyone have any advice? My main questions:

- Will an iMac with a couple of gigs of RAM run the latest version of Logic nice and smooth?

- What kind of sound card or interface is recommended to get multiple channels of audio into the computing machine?

- Will Logic have better sound quality than my cheap software, or will two programs using the same resolution produce the same sound quality?

wow! n-track! i used to use that program 10+ years ago. i think Reaper is actually cheaper tho...

I have switched to an M-Audio Firewire 410. I actually would have bought a Presonus Firebox, but no music store had one and I didn't have time to order online (Nur Ein time pressure).

The drivers and installation process are not solid on this device, although I have them working now-- I just don't trust them. It remains to be seen what the latency will be. I'm running it on a PCI Firewire card, with a 2 GHZ P4, 1GB RAM computer.

I switched from an M-Audio Delta-66 PCI card because it had no onboard MIDI connection. I have been using a MIDI-USB converter but I think it freezes my computer. Plus, I wanted something more portable and just plain newer.

I am probably far overdue for some PC upgrades, but for now I'm finished.

I'm going to try FL Studio, the biggest version, and see if that can be used as a complete DAW yet. I like Fruity, the only drawback being an inability to record analog sound into it. That seems to have been implemented, so I'm going to try it. It seems less cumbersome than having Fruity open in a Rewire session in Cubase.

The 410 also came with a Ableton Live Lite, so I'm going to give that a try too.

Octothorpe rocks the n-track as well.

I think http://www.endpcnoise.com will be who I go through. I'll let you know what I get.

I bought a new HP that was powerful as shit, but I didn't do my homework; they can't downgrade or dual-boot Windows XP anymore. So I've just sent it back.

I've had a 2-channel Universal Audio preamp for a few years and I feed that into my Mbox, but I am now going to feed it into an Apogee Rosetta 200 I got with warranty off ebay. So I'll have 4 channels of audio for recording other acts in the apartment, and two of those channels will sound godlike.

Once the new computer gets here I will use the old one for all other computing needs and devote this new one to Sonar, Pro Tools LE and the soft synth arsenal.

The new record will have a new recording of Cable Beach. I'm using a real drummer.

Melvin - I run Logic Studio on an old PPC 17" Powerbook laptop with PreSonus Inspire 1394 Firewire audio interface (2 channel, though 4 is supported via aux ins). As long as I keep plenty of disc free it runs very well up to 12 audio channels (depending on audio processing applied). Then I have to use the track freeze feature which cures all. I love the new Logic interface (single pane, with pop ups only for the plug-ins).

A new quad-core Mac tower would totally rock but I still work out of a closet so my dream studio (something like Adam!'s) will have to wait.

Well, it's not a dream setup, but with the Rosetta 200 and the mbox it's a HUGE step up from my last computer. I paid about $1750, plus a new monitor.

Asus M3A AM2+ Motherboard
AMD Phenom 9500 AM2 Quad Core CPU
4GB (four 1GB) Corsair PC-6400
Microsoft BLACK Keyboard/Mouse Combo
Hard Drive: Western Digital Quiet 320GB 7200RPM 16MB SATA 2 Hard Drive
Data Drive: Western Digital Quiet 640GB 7200RPM 16MB SATA 2 Hard Drive
Windows XP Professional 32 Bit
Nexus NX-8040 400 Watt 80 Plus Modular PSU
MSI 8400GS 256 Meg (Fanless) Video Card
Antec P182 BLACK Case
ASUS (BLACK) Quiet LightScribe 18X DVDRW
Zalman CNPS9500AM2 CPU Cooler

Solid state hard drives are the future of recording. The Macbook Air has one, I believe. The 3.5" drives should start coming down in price within a year or so.

My current setup is the following:

Windows XP SP2, never been reinstalled, used for everything from word processing to photoshop to surfing to itunes
P4 2Ghz
1GB RAM
80GB 7200 RPM IDE HD (that the OS is on)
80GB 7200 RPM IDE HD (that music is recorded to)
AGP video card

This computer is 6 years old and still going (knock on wood). I recorded albumfight on it among other stuff, and all my recent tunes except "Welcome To" which was done in Garageband on a G4 iBook.

My point is that I can upgrade to something pretty low-budget and still have a faster, more powerful computer than I have right now, which will suffice for my amateur recording needs. For example: http://www.thebookpc.com/product_info.p ... cts_id/367

I can load that with Windows XP, 4GB RAM, and some other stuff, and be at $809. I could probably even do with way less than that.

Not sexy, but if you're on a budget just remember that for what you and I are going to do with it, home-recording-wise, you could probably be happy with a lot less than if you were going to try to use it for gaming.

Sober wrote:Solid state hard drives are the future of recording. The Macbook Air has one, I believe. The 3.5" drives should start coming down in price within a year or so.

I wouldn't rush out and drop the extra $999 for the MacBook Air SSD (over the non-SSD version). For more info, check out these MacWorld articles:

http://www.macworld.com/article/132192/ ... r_ssd.html
http://www.macworld.com/article/131796/ ... r_ssd.html

Some day, though, SSDs are definitely going to be awesome, once they're really just like having 100s of GB of RAM.

jb wrote:My point is that I can upgrade to something pretty low-budget and still have a faster, more powerful computer than I have right now, which will suffice for my amateur recording needs. For example: http://www.thebookpc.com/product_info.p ... cts_id/367

Also, for about $300 you could add a used Universal Audio UAD-1 effects card and make this computer last another two years. The effects are amazing the the shift from your processor makes a world of difference.

Ken

or for a further 4000 dollars you could add an XITE-1 from sonic core, due for release soon.
This could push it life expectancy out for maybe 10 years. Serious DSP power and supreme effects and synths.
Im with Ken, moving stuff off of the main processor makes a huge difference.