Here's an idea....

[frankie big face]

Let me start by saying I like the four-fight format. I don't know why. Didn't really care for the two-fight format. Hated the three-figh format. Love the four-fight format. I'm complicated.

But here's something I thought of. What if every week there were three new titles and one winner's circle death fight. In this fight, the three winners of last week's fights would square off against each other. (I think some of you did this informally, but this would be more....uh, formal.) This would address one of my qualms with SF, which is that it goes by so damn fast. I listened to and voted on two fights this week, but it's almost impossible to get to them all. With the winners circle fight, the "top" songs get at least one more round of hearings, which is nice because they are (ahem) the best.

Listen, I don't start threads every day so don't give me a whole bunch of crap. It's just an idea.

[Southwest_Statistic]

I think that's a sweet idea dude.

[jack]

Let me start by saying I like the four-fight format. I don't know why. Didn't really care for the two-fight format. Hated the three-figh format. Love the four-fight format. I'm complicated.

But here's something I thought of. What if every week there were three new titles and one winner's circle death fight. In this fight, the three winners of last week's fights would square off against each other. (I think some of you did this informally, but this would be more....uh, formal.) This would address one of my qualms with SF, which is that it goes by so damn fast. I listened to and voted on two fights this week, but it's almost impossible to get to them all. With the winners circle fight, the "top" songs get at least one more round of hearings, which is nice because they are (ahem) the best.

Listen, I don't start threads every day so don't give me a whole bunch of crap. It's just an idea.

as far as the "winners circle" idea goes, until better correlation can be made between the vote count and perceived quality of the songs, this is a joke. the only thing the top vote getters are best at is getting the most votes, but to say they are the best songs is dubious at best. it also puts more emphasis on winning, which puts more emphasis on trying to win, which is still a meaningless win with no financial gain or incentive.

i hate 4 fights. i hated 3 fights. i hated 2 fights. i want one fight. unify, not divide. there should be one winner.

[c hack]

i hate 4 fights. i hated 3 fights. i hated 2 fights. i want one fight. unify, not divide. there should be one winner.

I like the idea of one fight, but it took me like an hour and a half to review one fight of the two-fight format. And I like reviewing all at once. If it was one fight, I'd never get around to doing reviews.

[Mogosagatai]

Instead of forcing voters to choose between the four (or however many) winners, some or all of whom they may not have voted for, why not just allow an extra vote: one vote for each of the fights, and one "Best Song of the Week" vote, which could go to any band in any fight.

Of course, this would completely nullify the purpose of FBF's idea, which is to give the "top circle" of songs more exposure.

But like Shite said, the songs with the most votes certainly aren't always the best. I'd venture to say they very rarely are. (Wow, four words in a row in the previous sentence end in 'y'!) I just think it'd be fun to have top song of the week, even though it would probably almost never be the truly best song.

But yeah, I love the four fight format. Plus, it just makes sense to have more fights when there's more fighters entering. As the number of fighters increases, the meaning behind votes gets thinner, and you eventually reach a point where votes really don't mean anything at all.

[deshead]

In this fight, the three winners of last week's fights would square off against each other.

Ya, I like this idea too. What about keeping the top 2 finishers from each fight? I often find the 2nd-place finisher has more staying power, or takes a little longer to grow on me, so I'd vote differently a week later. (Plus, like Jack said, frequently 'most votes' != 'best song')

[jack]

...........you eventually reach a point where votes really don't mean anything at all.

same could be said for winning.

[Mogosagatai]

No doubt.

[Spud]

Winning means nothing. We have won twice. That proves it.

[frankie big face]

as far as the "winners circle" idea goes, until better correlation can be made between the vote count and perceived quality of the songs, this is a joke.

well, gee Jack. it's just an idea. i happened to win this week and i made no special efforts to get votes and i do think my song was the best of the five, quite frankly. AND i don't care about winning. but clearly, this is serious business for you and i apologize for upsetting you so much. yikes.

P.S. Do you need financial gain or other incentive to try to write a better song than everyone else in one week? I hope not, because you've participated in like 800 songfights.

[thehipcola]

-maybe we should have seperate polling web-booths, one for "registered" voters (SF members) and one for "friends and passers-by". Then we could seperate those votes that we care about from those that are "friendly"...

(the above statement is an attempt at humour, poking fun at the ongoing debate about changing the format of SF...)
(it does not repreezent my position at all)
(so don't take it seriously)
(thank you.)

[thehipcola]

P.S. Do you need financial gain or other incentive to try to write a better song than everyone else in one week? I hope not, because you've participated in like 800 songfights.

I doubt it. Obviously the huge negative from caring too much about winning is the easy way one could fraudulently create votes and win. So the fall back and "real" reason many people are here for is the reviews and the awesome community that hangs 'round here.

[jack]

hey frankie, i don't really hate anything. or anyone. least of all you. this is a suggestion thread. i know you were just suggesting. and i was just opinioning. and i don't take any of it seriously, certainly not in the sense that i need to win. i enjoy songfight for it's community, and it's fun.

i'm just sayin some guys like their vodka all watered down and diluted. and some like it as one straight shot. whatever floats yer boat.

[frankie big face]

I am one of the last PROponents of the one-fight format, so you and I are in agreement there (although I don't think it really matters too much what we think). My problem is that you summed up my suggestion as "a joke," which pretty much makes me feel like suggestions aren't really welcome here. Then you proceeded to declare that anytime anyone wins it's a sham because the ballot box is stuffed. That's an awful lot of negativity in one post (and within 15 minutes after I started the thread!). So, I think I'll go back to being an innocent bystander and keep my mouth shut.

[jack]

sorry, i wasn't implying your idea was a joke. it has some merit. if the voting was really reflective of best (and thats a big if). it's just that often times the best song doesn't win. man, you of all people are living proof of that.

i'm just saying that it's probably not in the best interest of songfight to encourage people to bolster their vote, just to play again the next week in a special round.

and congratulations on a well earned and deserved win too.

[frankie big face]

okay, *hugs*. anyway, i just figure there are good songs flying by that i never get to hear and i also like the idea of ONE winner, which is what generated this idea. i also thought of including the top two songs (as someone else suggested), which would perhaps eliminate those songs that were not deserving of the top "prize." i don't know--i'm just talking.

[roymond]

-maybe we should have seperate polling web-booths, one for "registered" voters (SF members) and one for "friends and passers-by". Then we could seperate those votes that we care about from those that are "friendly"...

Yes! I would actually be interested in how I am heard by my peers, rather than Frankie's vote-flooding offspring.

Either that or we can have two votes, one for the favorite (as it is currently), and one for the "best".

And I'm not joking.

[Caravan Ray]

Let me start by saying I like the four-fight format. I don't know why. Didn't really care for the two-fight format. Hated the three-figh format. Love the four-fight format. I'm complicated.

But here's something I thought of. What if every week there were three new titles and one winner's circle death fight. In this fight, the three winners of last week's fights would square off against each other. (I think some of you did this informally, but this would be more....uh, formal.) This would address one of my qualms with SF, which is that it goes by so damn fast. I listened to and voted on two fights this week, but it's almost impossible to get to them all. With the winners circle fight, the "top" songs get at least one more round of hearings, which is nice because they are (ahem) the best.

Listen, I don't start threads every day so don't give me a whole bunch of crap. It's just an idea.

Good idea

I also rarely get to listen to all the songs - having a best of the best round the next week would be a good chance to ensure that "the best" will at leats get a listen.

And to cover Jacks complaint re friend flooders - pick the top 2 or top 3 voted for songs in each fight for the best or the best round. (ie 3 fights - top 3 from each - 9 songs in the championship round). Re-voting on the top 9 songs from the whole week would probably sort the sheep from the goats.

[jack]

i wasn't complaining. and as we all know, the "best" is nothing more than a matter of opinion, even if "consensus" is pretty much an illusion around here.

they didn't announce 4 winners for best picture last night. just one.

[Caravan Ray]

they didn't announce 4 winners for best picture last night. just one.

Did they award a best picture Oscar?

Every news bulletin I've heard over that last 24 or so hours started with the lead story "Cate Blanchette wins Best Supporting Actress!" I love the smell of nationalistic fervour in the morning...

[tonetripper]

I have a problem with this idea in principal. The principal being that this is Songfight! and not Bestsongoftheweekfight!. For me the idea of SF is that you truly write the best song for the title. Meaning that Back to Brazil and ABCD Puppies really have no right to face off against one another for a particular week (although CCS ruled both of those fights for me). The idea for me is that you write the best song for the title and that is sometimes a stylistic concept that keeps thematically with the title, or so I think it should .

Although I have heard some great numbers for the oddest of titles and the voting goes this way, I do have an issue with the concept of it all about being the best song for the week. Does that mean that we vote for the best song thematically and single the tunes out and compare how they relate for the title? And which one is best written for a specific title?

That means Josh W. (not to single you out buddy) could write something for some title in the style he apparently is more abject to and because of his awesome production skillz he could sew up the week's fight on a regular basis. Even with the title Gallows Hill or per instance God Will Give You Blood to Drink. Do we want to encourage a standard of production or do we want to uphold the values of writing the best song for the title? I would be a hypocrite to say that my reasons for exploring music sometimes for SF drag me away from the title, but that is not to say that I don't endeavour to do so in the best way that suits the title. I just think it's a difficult line to cross without ruffling feathers. But maybe that would be cool too. I'm fence-sitting I know.

What I think would be cooler is if perhaps the FM were to post on the main page from week to week the top winner's tunes for each of the titles. Maybe in the header of the winners circle as a posted mp3 (extra work I know and with the 4 fight format - which rules - may be not in their best interst) I still think as Jack that it may encourage something we drive often to get away from as a community, but it would mean an extra bit of exposure to people who perhaps haven't ff'ed. The controversay can be fun. That fence is going right up my friggin' ass.

[Caravan Ray]

I have a problem with this idea in principal. The principal being that this is Songfight! and not Bestsongoftheweekfight!. For me the idea of SF is that you truly write the best song for the title. Meaning that Back to Brazil and ABCD Puppies really have no right to face off against one another for a particular week

I hadn't thought of it that way - I think you're right - in hindsight I retract my previous suggestion.