just intonation, etc.

jeff robertson · Post by **jeff robertson** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 7:51 pm

The keyboard thread kind of reminded me of something I was thinking about recently. Can any of these keyboards "do" scales other than equal tempered? I've been reading about just intonation and meantone temperment and things like that since I was a kid and I've always wanted to have a keyboard that you could (easily) switch into different historical temperments. As a keyboard player I'm sort of the equivalent of a hunt-and-peck typist, so I doubt I'll be playing an Baroque music, but I'd really just like to be able to sit down an "jam" for a bit on chords that haven't been heard since 1750.

thehipcola · Post by **thehipcola** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 8:05 pm

Don't know about synth type keyboards, but many digital pianos (which are a few bucks unfortunately) come with the ability to change temperaments like that. It's pretty wack. But Bach sounds interestingly different using temperaments more common from his era than a modern equal temperament.

I'll try to find it if your interested...there was a CD available at the piano tuning convention (yah, those are actual events..

) where classical works from different eras were performed on instruments tuned as they probably were at the time they were written. Some stuff was very subtle, some stuff was phenomenally better and far more intense.

bz£ · Post by **bz£** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:24 am

My synth (the Proteus) does varied scales, but, microtonals and things like Gamelan scales aside, you'll hardly hear a difference. It's true: some Bach stuff does sound different, but it's not like these are magical new chords.

Of course, I'm far too tone-deaf to ever be allowed into a piano tuning convention, so take my opinion lightly. I'm just saying that I think you'll be disappointed if you do get the chance to try out alternate temperaments.

deshead · Post by **deshead** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 6:34 am

Here are some free utils for re-tempering midi files: http://www.dogstar.dantimax.dk/midiutil/

And software that generates tuning files for many popular synths: http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/scala/

Sober · Post by **Sober** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 4:49 pm

I'm pretty sure my motif es can do that, and I'm very sure I don't care enough to ever find out.

roymond · Post by **roymond** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 7:32 pm

bzl wrote:It's true: some Bach stuff does sound different, but it's not like these are magical new chords.

Actually, the difference is often quite intense. JB will fill us in with the musicalogical historifics. The scales (relationships) we're talking about may include such things as:

- The note "b" is be closer to "c"
- "b-flat" is closer to "a"

These two things make b a far more leading note, both harmonically and melodically, to c than we're used to. B-flat wants to fall down to a...there's more gravity involved. That's why the key you composed in impacted the "tone" of the music a great deal.

I'm sure there's a good Wikipedia article. Oh hey, look! I wasted my breath and probably misguided the reader in one simple post.

Also, horns and other instruments didn't have valves and other devices to allow equal temperment. They relied heavily on the frequency multiplication charts of nature. [edit bla bla bla]

Steve Durand · Post by **Steve Durand** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 8:05 pm

Sorry Roymond, But the trumpet solo on Penny Lane was not played with a real baroque trumpet. it was played on a Bb piccolo trumpet that definitely had valves.

Steve

roymond · Post by **roymond** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 8:55 pm

sdurand wrote:Sorry Roymond, But the trumpet solo on Penny Lane was not played with a real baroque trumpet. it was played on a Bb piccolo trumpet that definitely had valves.

I take your word but will dig up my sources. Thanks.

Steve Durand · Post by **Steve Durand** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:24 pm

I started playing the trumpet in 1968 and this is one of those trivia kind of things that I learned and will probably stick in my brain long after my short term memory is gone.

That, and Al Hirt playing "Flight of the Bumblebee".

Steve

roymond · Post by **roymond** » Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:56 pm

See? I told you I was spreading misinformation. Never doubted you. Of course simply listening to it now in this context makes it obvious.

Sober · Post by **Sober** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:51 pm

Great. Now for the next two months it'll be nothing but:

"Tune your guitar before you record, assbag."

"I'M USING ALTERNATIVE TUNINGS. I R ARTFUL."

bz£ · Post by **bz£** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 3:13 am

People have been telling me that for decades. I try not to let it bother me, though; after all, it's just intonation.